So why the drastic change in beliefs?

[Tarheel Baptist]

[quote author=RAIDER]Teaching that you can lose your salvation
The faith healing circus'.
Holy laughter.

Teaching that all you have to do is say a prayer, in fact you have to say a prayer, and you're saved, regardless of any other evidence to the contrary.
The tithe "blessing" circus.
Holy high schools.

...oh wait, you said AoG, not IFB...

Now you are going off the deep end.
[/quote]

He lives in the deep end....

 

[BALAAM]

I don't want to pick on anyone here, because poor theological training is a characteristic of HAC. Concerning heresy:

Titus 3:10-11 teach plainly that a heretic is unsaved  "A man that is an heretick after the first and second admonition reject;  Knowing that he that is such is subverted, and sinneth, being condemned of himself."

Because there is no condemnation to them that are in Christ Jesús, and because that which is born of God sinneth not, a genuine Christian cannot remain a heretic. Heresy refers to doctrines that prove that a person is lost. Denying the Gospel, denying the Deity of Christ, etc., are heresies, and a person who clings to those doctrines after being admonished is not born again.

Baptism, eternal security, Calvinism, speaking in tongues, church government, the Rapture, which translation to use, etc., do not involve heresy. A genuine Christian can be mistaken in these áreas. Don't let somebody scare you into or out of a doctrine with threats and accusation. God hasn't given us a spirit of fear. When God wants you to change your belief, the Holy Spirit will teach you the truth.

Most people who have been raised in the 1980's to 2010's are of the opinion that of the thousands of church services available you can choose exactly what you think is true and go to a church like that. That is not typical of most of the world in which we live.

 

[RAIDER]

[quote author=RAIDER]Teaching that you can lose your salvation
The faith healing circus'.
Holy laughter.

Teaching that all you have to do is say a prayer, in fact you have to say a prayer, and you're saved, regardless of any other evidence to the contrary.
The tithe "blessing" circus.
Holy high schools.

...oh wait, you said AoG, not IFB...

Now you are going off the deep end.

He lives in the deep end....
[/quote]

I believe you speak truth.

 

[prophet]

I don't want to pick on anyone here, because poor theological training is a characteristic of HAC. Concerning heresy:

Titus 3:10-11 teach plainly that a heretic is unsaved  "A man that is an heretick after the first and second admonition reject;  Knowing that he that is such is subverted, and sinneth, being condemned of himself."

Because there is no condemnation to them that are in Christ Jesús, and because that which is born of God sinneth not, a genuine Christian cannot remain a heretic. Heresy refers to doctrines that prove that a person is lost. Denying the Gospel, denying the Deity of Christ, etc., are heresies, and a person who clings to those doctrines after being admonished is not born again.

Baptism, eternal security, Calvinism, speaking in tongues, church government, the Rapture, which translation to use, etc., do not involve heresy. A genuine Christian can be mistaken in these áreas. Don't let somebody scare you into or out of a doctrine with threats and accusation. God hasn't given us a spirit of fear. When God wants you to change your belief, the Holy Spirit will teach you the truth.

"My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me : And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither can any man pluck them out of my hand"
Sorry, anyone who doesn't believe in eternal security is not a believer.  They are not His sheep.  They are a damned lost heretick, if they claim to be a believer, but deny eternal life, and everlasting life.  If they won't repent after the 2nd admonition, they are to be rejected.
So much for most of the leadership in your assemblies of god DEMONination.
Anishinabe

Fixed by admin

 

[IFB X-Files]

I don't want to pick on anyone here, because poor theological training is a characteristic of HAC. Concerning heresy:

Titus 3:10-11 teach plainly that a heretic is unsaved  "A man that is an heretick after the first and second admonition reject;  Knowing that he that is such is subverted, and sinneth, being condemned of himself."

Because there is no condemnation to them that are in Christ Jesús, and because that which is born of God sinneth not, a genuine Christian cannot remain a heretic. Heresy refers to doctrines that prove that a person is lost. Denying the Gospel, denying the Deity of Christ, etc., are heresies, and a person who clings to those doctrines after being admonished is not born again.

Baptism, eternal security, Calvinism, speaking in tongues, church government, the Rapture, which translation to use, etc., do not involve heresy. A genuine Christian can be mistaken in these áreas. Don't let somebody scare you into or out of a doctrine with threats and accusation. God hasn't given us a spirit of fear. When God wants you to change your belief, the Holy Spirit will teach you the truth.

Sorry, anyone who doesn't believe in eternal security is not a believer.  They are not His sheep.  They are a damned lost heretick, if they claim to be a believer, but deny eternal life, and everlasting life.  If they won't repent after the 2nd admonition, they are to be rejected.  So much for most of the leadership in your ass. of god DEMONination.

Don't hold back.  Tell us what you REALLY think!

 

[RAIDER]

"My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me : And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither can any man pluck them out of my hand"
Sorry, anyone who doesn't believe in eternal security is not a believer.  They are not His sheep.  They are a damned lost heretick, if they claim to be a believer, but deny eternal life, and everlasting life.  If they won't repent after the 2nd admonition, they are to be rejected.
So much for most of the leadership in your assemblies of god DEMONination.
Anishinabe

Fixed by admin
[/quote]

If you are not careful you are going to offend the two Charismatics on the FFF.

 

[prophet]

I made it a lower case g, don't I get an 'A' for effort? 

Anishinabe

 

[BALAAM]

"My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me : And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither can any man pluck them out of my hand"
Sorry, anyone who doesn't believe in eternal security is not a believer.  They are not His sheep.  They are a damned lost heretick, if they claim to be a believer, but deny eternal life, and everlasting life.  If they won't repent after the 2nd admonition, they are to be rejected.
So much for most of the leadership in your assemblies of god DEMONination.
Anishinabe

Fixed by admin

I have to pick at this a little Raider. First of all I don't know of two charismatics. Second of all; If you had been reading any of Massi's posts he is not a charismatic. He lives in an area where there is no other viable place to go. I wonder what people do in other countries where they do not have 35 different flavors of Bible believing churches to go to? It is either go a church different than you have been raised in or stay home.
If you are not careful you are going to offend the two Charismatics on the FFF.


I would have a very hard time going to an AOG church. But, if it were go to an aog or stay home I would probably go.[/quote]

 

[RAIDER]

I have to pick at this a little Raider. First of all I don't know of two charismatics. Second of all; If you had been reading any of Massi's posts he is not a charismatic. He lives in an area where there is no other viable place to go. I wonder what people do in other countries where they do not have 35 different flavors of Bible believing churches to go to? It is either go a church different than you have been raised in or stay home.
If you are not careful you are going to offend the two Charismatics on the FFF.


I would have a very hard time going to an AOG church. But, if it were go to an aog or stay home I would probably go.

[/quote]

I don't believe Massi said there was no viable place to go.  I believe he is critical of the Baptist churches in his area.  Perhaps his criticism is valid.  If you have read him much on the FFF, this could go either way.

If there is not a doctrinally sound church (which the AofG is NOT) in the area should he not go to a place where there is one?

 

[patriotic]

I have to pick at this a little Raider. First of all I don't know of two charismatics. Second of all; If you had been reading any of Massi's posts he is not a charismatic. He lives in an area where there is no other viable place to go. I wonder what people do in other countries where they do not have 35 different flavors of Bible believing churches to go to? It is either go a church different than you have been raised in or stay home.
If you are not careful you are going to offend the two Charismatics on the FFF.


I would have a very hard time going to an AOG church. But, if it were go to an aog or stay home I would probably go.

I don't believe Massi said there was no viable place to go.  I believe he is critical of the Baptist churches in his area.  Perhaps his criticism is valid.  If you have read him much on the FFF, this could go either way.

If there is not a doctrinally sound church (which the AofG is NOT) in the area should he not go to a place where there is one?
[/quote]

Or start one? 

 

[RAIDER]

I have to pick at this a little Raider. First of all I don't know of two charismatics. Second of all; If you had been reading any of Massi's posts he is not a charismatic. He lives in an area where there is no other viable place to go. I wonder what people do in other countries where they do not have 35 different flavors of Bible believing churches to go to? It is either go a church different than you have been raised in or stay home.
If you are not careful you are going to offend the two Charismatics on the FFF.


I would have a very hard time going to an AOG church. But, if it were go to an aog or stay home I would probably go.

I don't believe Massi said there was no viable place to go.  I believe he is critical of the Baptist churches in his area.  Perhaps his criticism is valid.  If you have read him much on the FFF, this could go either way.

If there is not a doctrinally sound church (which the AofG is NOT) in the area should he not go to a place where there is one?

Or start one?
[/quote]

Preeeeeeech it, sister!!

 

[prophet]

I have to pick at this a little Raider. First of all I don't know of two charismatics. Second of all; If you had been reading any of Massi's posts he is not a charismatic. He lives in an area where there is no other viable place to go. I wonder what people do in other countries where they do not have 35 different flavors of Bible believing churches to go to? It is either go a church different than you have been raised in or stay home.
If you are not careful you are going to offend the two Charismatics on the FFF.


I would have a very hard time going to an AOG church. But, if it were go to an aog or stay home I would probably go.

I don't believe Massi said there was no viable place to go.  I believe he is critical of the Baptist churches in his area.  Perhaps his criticism is valid.  If you have read him much on the FFF, this could go either way.

If there is not a doctrinally sound church (which the AofG is NOT) in the area should he not go to a place where there is one?

Or start one?
[/quote]My reaction as well.
But the AOG is exciting.  And they really love having actual saved people around.  They will give you all the attention you crave.  'Course, you have to fake a 'prayer toungue', or feel inferior. Jam for Jesus, have roast Baptist for lunch, and gobble like a turkey.  Save people from Hades, whatever that is. 
You are weak minded, or manipulative, if you fit in that system.

Anishinabe

 

[Smellin Coffee]

I have to pick at this a little Raider. First of all I don't know of two charismatics. Second of all; If you had been reading any of Massi's posts he is not a charismatic. He lives in an area where there is no other viable place to go. I wonder what people do in other countries where they do not have 35 different flavors of Bible believing churches to go to? It is either go a church different than you have been raised in or stay home.
If you are not careful you are going to offend the two Charismatics on the FFF.


I would have a very hard time going to an AOG church. But, if it were go to an aog or stay home I would probably go.

I don't believe Massi said there was no viable place to go.  I believe he is critical of the Baptist churches in his area.  Perhaps his criticism is valid.  If you have read him much on the FFF, this could go either way.

If there is not a doctrinally sound church (which the AofG is NOT) in the area should he not go to a place where there is one?

My reaction as well.
But the AOG is exciting.  And they really love having actual saved people around.  They will give you all the attention you crave.  'Course, you have to fake a 'prayer toungue', or feel inferior. Jam for Jesus, have roast Baptist for lunch, and gobble like a turkey.  Save people from Hades, whatever that is. 
You are weak minded, or manipulative, if you fit in that system.

Anishinabe

Not true of the AOG people that I have been associated with throughout the years. Though some of them (not all by any means) believe in 'tongues' (public or private), there are some really sincere Christians in that group and the ones that I have met have not been the type to criticize other religous groups or even claim tongues as making one more "spiritual".

Lost touch with my AOG friends after moving to NC but that has been my experience.

 

[prophet]

I have family, many friends whom I ministered to, and many acquaintances in AOG.  I have heard that among AOG/COG and other charismatic offshoots, Baptists are the 'bad guy' in the 'what not to be' illustrations, from many sources.  I could tell personal stories all day, but they aren't conclusive evidence, every man must give account of himself to God.  I cannot but speak the things which I have seen and heard.  If you believe 'everlasting' means 'everlasting', you might as well be Satan....or you were sent from God to finally bring 'good news'.


Anishinabe

 

[Vince Massi]

Hey, Coffee, would you consider retiring to Mexico?

 

[rsc2a]

[quote author=Smellin Coffee]Not true of the AOG people that I have been associated with throughout the years. Though some of them (not all by any means) believe in 'tongues' (public or private), there are some really sincere Christians in that group and the ones that I have met have not been the type to criticize other religous groups or even claim tongues as making one more "spiritual". [/quote]

They can't be sincere Christians if they aren't judging the salvation of others by agreement on a bunch of secondary, tertiary, or even quaternary issues!

 

[Vince Massi]

[quote author=Smellin Coffee]Not true of the AOG people that I have been associated with throughout the years. Though some of them (not all by any means) believe in 'tongues' (public or private), there are some really sincere Christians in that group and the ones that I have met have not been the type to criticize other religous groups or even claim tongues as making one more "spiritual".

They can't be sincere Christians if they aren't judging the salvation of others by agreement on a bunch of secondary, tertiary, or even quaternary issues!
[/quote]

Hey, Old Buddy, readers might not understand that you were using satire. That's the opposite of what you actually believe. And the same as Coffee--why don't you retire and get down here?

 

[Smellin Coffee]

Hey, Coffee, would you consider retiring to Mexico?

Not at this point.

I've got shut-in and aging parental units for whom my wife and I care. And 3 kids in school yet. And it would be extremely difficult to pry my wife away from her grandchildren when we get to that stage in life. Besides, I've got 20 years before retirement age. 

 

[RAIDER]

I have family, many friends whom I ministered to, and many acquaintances in AOG.  I have heard that among AOG/COG and other charismatic offshoots, Baptists are the 'bad guy' in the 'what not to be' illustrations, from many sources.  I could tell personal stories all day, but they aren't conclusive evidence, every man must give account of himself to God.  I cannot but speak the things which I have seen and heard.  If you believe 'everlasting' means 'everlasting', you might as well be Satan....or you were sent from God to finally bring 'good news'.


Anishinabe

Prophet, I also have friends who are AofG folk and my experiences are the same as yours.  Sometime listen to Donnie Swaggart preach (and, yes, he can shuck the corn!)  )  From time-to-time he will take a jab at Baptist for not believing in tongues, etc.

 

[BALAAM]

I have family, many friends whom I ministered to, and many acquaintances in AOG.  I have heard that among AOG/COG and other charismatic offshoots, Baptists are the 'bad guy' in the 'what not to be' illustrations, from many sources.  I could tell personal stories all day, but they aren't conclusive evidence, every man must give account of himself to God.  I cannot but speak the things which I have seen and heard.  If you believe 'everlasting' means 'everlasting', you might as well be Satan....or you were sent from God to finally bring 'good news'.


Anishinabe

Prophet, I also have friends who are AofG folk and my experiences are the same as yours.  Sometime listen to Donnie Swaggart preach (and, yes, he can shuck the corn!)  )  From time-to-time he will take a jab at Baptist for not believing in tongues, etc.

You are exactly right on this. Jimmie Swaggart, on the other hand, has mellowed quite a bit over the years. In his younger days he would chastise the Baptists for not walking after the same beliefs as him but I don't hear him use the same tone much any more. Donnie on the other hand...... I have never wasted much money on any of his stuff.