Stuff Only IFB People Understand

  • Thread starter Thread starter Dr. Huk-N-Duck
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Congregation: dear visitors, our communion is for church members only.
Closed communion isn't an IFB distinctive. Many Brethren churches do the same. They might even go so far as to limit the Lord's Supper part of the service to their own membership.
 
Congregation: Billy Graham has compromised his faith and values. He is guilty of ecumenicism. He has no problem sitting on stage and rubbing elbows with Muslims, Jews and charismatics!
 
Congregation: Billy Graham has compromised his faith and values. He is guilty of ecumenicism. He has no problem sitting on stage and rubbing elbows with Muslims, Jews and charismatics!


I remember in the church that I grew up in, the church felt the same way about Dr Graham. It also felt that way about Dr Falwell and I distinctly remember hearing the pastor refer to Dr Martin Luther King as "Martin LUCIFER King. And I would imagine that it would be easy to stand in judgement on this pastor looking down on those who were less strict than he but then,

y'all stand in judgement on those who are strictER than you so

who has the inner ear of God?

Anymore than Pee Wee Herman should criticize Arnold Schwarzenegger for the number of reps he did, I would never criticize Dr Graham OR Dr Jones (as to their manners of ministry - I'm not talking about sexual issues) unless I had accomplished a miniscule of what both men had accomplished as they had "put on the whole armor" of God in their fight against Satan.

It just seems to me with 60,000,000 MILLION little babies being butchered and and the mother's right to her child's murder celebrated, by prayer having been banned in schools, with every type of violent and evil thing being promoted on television, and yes, with children being encouraged to dance in drag clubs and drag queens coming to school to read to them, that

y'all would have more to do than to mock your brethren. I have never understood your disdain for "fundies" and "standards" when at the same time, you believe that the devil is walking about seeking whom he may devour. I truly don't understand your reasoning. Your seeming preocupation with christian women not being able to wear pants and things of that nature is quiet perplexing given the atmosphere we live in today. If the Devil really is at your child's door, along with his demons, should you really be worrying if the pastor down the street has a "standard" that you feel is unnecessary? I would think you would join arm in arm with him and his dress wearing women, as you concentrate on the devil coming out of your living room television and more realisticly, the one coming out of your child's Instagram and Facebook.

If the devil and principalities of this world are real, leave your fellow warriors who may have one too many unnecessary metals on their armor - alone. And concentrate, instead on your common enemy.
 
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I remember in the church that I grew up in, the church felt the same way about Dr Graham. It also felt that way about Dr Falwell and I distinctly remember hearing the pastor refer to Dr Martin Luther King as "Martin LUCIFER King. And I would imagine that it would be easy to stand in judgement on this pastor looking down on those who were less strict than he but then,

y'all stand in judgement on those who are strictER than you so

who has the inner ear of God?
In all fairness to your pastor, the “Reverend” MLK did have some skeletons in his closet, but his message was mostly good of course.
I'm not talking about sexual issues
Any particular reason you are omitting this one particular piece from the pulpit and the Bible?
y'all would have more to do than to mock your brethren. I have never understood your disdain for "fundies" and "standards" when at the same time, you believe that the devil is walking about seeking whom he may devour. I truly don't understand your reasoning.
Exactly who is mocking? I’m just pointing out some IFB memories that I may (or may not) agree with. I also posted about dodgeball and big ball volleyball. Of course those aren’t necessarily unique to IFB youth groups, but they were good memories.
If the devil and principalities of this world are real, leave your fellow warriors who may have one too many unnecessary metals on their armor - alone. And concentrate, instead on your common enemy.
In my experience in life, the devil is often someone who appears as an angel, but in reality is something all together very different than what he portrays. The devil doesn’t usually present himself as the devil.
 
I can see how you might think I was directing my thoughts at THIS thread but I'm referring to YEARS worth of posts. I just never have understood it. That's all.
About the sexual thing, what I meant was that I would give pause before I criticized a pastor much greater than myself over his position on something like pants or going to the movies. BUT THAT if he was DISHONEST and UNFAITHFUL to his wife, that's a different matter.
 
Congregation: we only use the King James Version of the Bible. All other versions of the Bible are heretical.
Yep, I grew up with that horse puckey! I started reading the Bible through comic books after that just to tick the preacher off!
 
We have the Lord's Supper on a non-regularly scheduled service time, but it is announced ahead of time as to the exact date and time. That's enough to let people out of taking it that aren't committed members. And for the record, our church doesn't have an official position in writing, but to my knowledge of how we've operated since our founding in 1967 the practice of "close" communion has been observed, which is where I stand on the subject personally.
"Close" communion is what most Churches I have attended have followed and I do agree for the most part. It is a time of closeness and intimacy with the Lord and with each other as we examine ourselves. It is something not to be rushed or taken flippantly.

I believe those who take things to the extreme I have mentioned (Baptists anyway) are strict "Local Church" even to the point of rejecting the "Universal Church" and they are adamant about things like Baptist perpetuity (succession) to the point that they will likely re-baptize anyone who has not been previously baptized in a Baptist Church that they specifically know and approve of and can receive proper verification. Many Churches in the BBF are like this and Paul Chappell leans hard in this direction but not to the extreme of the congregation I was part of in Guam while I was there (which was BBF).
 
About the sexual thing, what I meant was that I would give pause before I criticized a pastor much greater than myself over his position on something like pants or going to the movies. BUT THAT if he was DISHONEST and UNFAITHFUL to his wife, that's a different matter.
I kind of get what you mean, but honestly, it doesn’t really matter what man does because ultimately, that’s all a preacher is, a sinful human. What God says is ultimately all that counts, and each of us are ultimately accountable for our actions.
 
I remember in the church that I grew up in, the church felt the same way about Dr Graham. It also felt that way about Dr Falwell and I distinctly remember hearing the pastor refer to Dr Martin Luther King as "Martin LUCIFER King. And I would imagine that it would be easy to stand in judgement on this pastor looking down on those who were less strict than he but then,

y'all stand in judgement on those who are strictER than you so

who has the inner ear of God?

Anymore than Pee Wee Herman should criticize Arnold Schwarzenegger for the number of reps he did, I would never criticize Dr Graham OR Dr Jones (as to their manners of ministry - I'm not talking about sexual issues) unless I had accomplished a miniscule of what both men had accomplished as they had "put on the whole armor" of God in their fight against Satan.

It just seems to me with 60,000,000 MILLION little babies being butchered and and the mother's right to her child's murder celebrated, by prayer having been banned in schools, with every type of violent and evil thing being promoted on television, and yes, with children being encouraged to dance in drag clubs and drag queens coming to school to read to them, that

y'all would have more to do than to mock your brethren. I have never understood your disdain for "fundies" and "standards" when at the same time, you believe that the devil is walking about seeking whom he may devour. I truly don't understand your reasoning. Your seeming preocupation with christian women not being able to wear pants and things of that nature is quiet perplexing given the atmosphere we live in today. If the Devil really is at your child's door, along with his demons, should you really be worrying if the pastor down the street has a "standard" that you feel is unnecessary? I would think you would join arm in arm with him and his dress wearing women, as you concentrate on the devil coming out of your living room television and more realisticly, the one coming out of your child's Instagram and Facebook.

If the devil and principalities of this world are real, leave your fellow warriors who may have one too many unnecessary metals on their armor - alone. And concentrate, instead on your common enemy.
They are speaking of silly things they remember in certain IFB Churches. There were many "Standards" that were pushed that were actually detrimental to personal holiness, They made you "look good" but actually covered up a good bit of bad behavior.

You are mentioning some things that are actually a little more serious here. Billy Graham started out really good and he always preached a sound gospel message during his crusades but his positions later in life were quite troublesome and were actually detrimental to the gospel message he had been faithfully preaching.

We should not refer to Martin Luther King as Martin "Lucifer" King and many objected to him for racist reasons but his theology was clearly heretical! He denied Christ's deity, his substitutionary atonement, and bodily resurrection. He did some "Good things" related to the civil rights movement and for this, he used Christianity as a "Means to an end." These are things that should have been brought up but I really didn't learn much about his theology and false teaching until AFTER I had left certain IFB Churches that referred to him as Martin "Lucifer" King.

But yes, we should be focused upon the preaching of the GOSPEL because the Gospel is the only thing that can change and transform lives! The Church is in bad, bad shape these days and is largely ineffective!
 
They are speaking of silly things they remember in certain IFB Churches. There were many "Standards" that were pushed that were actually detrimental to personal holiness, They made you "look good" but actually covered up a good bit of bad behavior.

You are mentioning some things that are actually a little more serious here. Billy Graham started out really good and he always preached a sound gospel message during his crusades but his positions later in life were quite troublesome and were actually detrimental to the gospel message he had been faithfully preaching.

We should not refer to Martin Luther King as Martin "Lucifer" King and many objected to him for racist reasons but his theology was clearly heretical! He denied Christ's deity, his substitutionary atonement, and bodily resurrection. He did some "Good things" related to the civil rights movement and for this, he used Christianity as a "Means to an end." These are things that should have been brought up but I really didn't learn much about his theology and false teaching until AFTER I had left certain IFB Churches that referred to him as Martin "Lucifer" King.

But yes, we should be focused upon the preaching of the GOSPEL because the Gospel is the only thing that can change and transform lives! The Church is in bad, bad shape these days and is largely ineffective!
I’ve long known about King’s skeletons from information the FBI gained by bugging him. Allegedly, he had over 40 affairs, a child out of wedlock, etc.
Martin Luther King Jr had 40 affairs and laughed as friend raped woman
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...tml?ito=native_share_article-nativemenubutton
Martin Luther King Jr had 40 affairs and laughed as friend raped woman
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...tml?ito=native_share_article-nativemenubutton

However, I’d be interested in seeing some information related to his theology. That seems more difficult to find online.
 
However, I’d be interested in seeing some information related to his theology. That seems more difficult to find online
FWIW:

I've heard he denied the diety of Christ.

For a Baptist minister, his message was more political than spiritual. If proclaiming the gospel was his priority, his message would have sounded a lot different.

His niece, Alveda King, has been very prominent in the pro-life movement. She is certainly a darling of conservative evangelism. While i do appreciate her activism, I know little else about her. Unfortunately, if an activist's stand resonates with the church's political position, the Gospel becomes secondary and a pass is issued for somtimes major doctrinal differences. Ive seen this to be true in all sects, even the one I hang with. Now, I'm not saying anything for or against Alveda King... I'm just stating what I've observed.
 
He denied Christ's deity, his substitutionary atonement, and bodily resurrection.
That's what I've heard but I've heard it only from those with a political axe to grind against Him. Do we have this information from a more neutral source? As I said about His niece, she's currently a darling of right wing conservative evangelism because of her pro-life stance. I've not heard the criticisms of her I've heard of her uncle.
 
That's what I've heard but I've heard it only from those with a political axe to grind against Him. Do we have this information from a more neutral source? As I said about His niece, she's currently a darling of right wing conservative evangelism because of her pro-life stance. I've not heard the criticisms of her I've heard of her uncle.

Here's a perspective from somebody on the left (ie, no "axe to grind" with MLK) that validates his liberal penchant. Social justice and liberal education definitely clouded his vision of what we know to be standard evangelical doctrines that stem from a literalist understanding of fundamental theological doctrines (like inerrancy).
 
Here's a perspective from somebody on the left (ie, no "axe to grind" with MLK) that validates his liberal penchant. Social justice and liberal education definitely clouded his vision of what we know to be standard evangelical doctrines that stem from a literalist understanding of fundamental theological doctrines (like inerrancy).
Wow. That is a great article. I've encountered SFGATE before and the SF has always been a red flag, but I have found some of their writings to be profound and useful. Go figure.
 
Wow. That is a great article. I've encountered SFGATE before and the SF has always been a red flag, but I have found some of their writings to be profound and useful. Go figure.

I started to link to this article, which is a white dude who has particular bias in favor of social justice and ironically a seminary student at a doctrinally conservative/reformed evangelical school in MS, but the other one answered your query a bit better.
 
I remember in the church that I grew up in, the church felt the same way about Dr Graham. It also felt that way about Dr Falwell and I distinctly remember hearing the pastor refer to Dr Martin Luther King as "Martin LUCIFER King. And I would imagine that it would be easy to stand in judgement on this pastor looking down on those who were less strict than he but then,

y'all stand in judgement on those who are strictER than you so

who has the inner ear of God?

Anymore than Pee Wee Herman should criticize Arnold Schwarzenegger for the number of reps he did, I would never criticize Dr Graham OR Dr Jones (as to their manners of ministry - I'm not talking about sexual issues) unless I had accomplished a miniscule of what both men had accomplished as they had "put on the whole armor" of God in their fight against Satan.

It just seems to me with 60,000,000 MILLION little babies being butchered and and the mother's right to her child's murder celebrated, by prayer having been banned in schools, with every type of violent and evil thing being promoted on television, and yes, with children being encouraged to dance in drag clubs and drag queens coming to school to read to them, that

y'all would have more to do than to mock your brethren. I have never understood your disdain for "fundies" and "standards" when at the same time, you believe that the devil is walking about seeking whom he may devour. I truly don't understand your reasoning. Your seeming preocupation with christian women not being able to wear pants and things of that nature is quiet perplexing given the atmosphere we live in today. If the Devil really is at your child's door, along with his demons, should you really be worrying if the pastor down the street has a "standard" that you feel is unnecessary? I would think you would join arm in arm with him and his dress wearing women, as you concentrate on the devil coming out of your living room television and more realisticly, the one coming out of your child's Instagram and Facebook.

If the devil and principalities of this world are real, leave your fellow warriors who may have one too many unnecessary metals on their armor - alone. And concentrate, instead on your common enemy.

You bring up a valid point, in that we Baptists/Fundys/Conservatives/Christians often shoot our own wounded. That is well worth heeding as an admonition, no ifs ands or buts.

But ;), the nuanced worthwhile aspect of the issue that you raise about this site and the problem of attacking each other while the devil dances with glee is also worthy of a little closer inspection. What should be readily evident, as you've been around and observed here a lonnnng time, is that within historical orthodox/conservative/evangelical Christianity ("biblical Christianity") there has always raged a legitimate battle (which you can also see within the text of the NT Scriptures, ie, Galatians explicitly) over the problem of legalism. Man always seems to want to add rules that bind other people's conscience and that addition is often overstating what God has explicitly given as law/command. On the other side of the coin you find that some people want to justify their immorality by exclaiming that their sin is magnifying the copious amount of God's wonderful grace (Rom 6:1). So the battle over antinomianism (sinning by railing against God's law and abusing His grace) and legalism (adding to explicit commands of God in order to earn favor with God) rages, and sometimes collateral damage occurs when we contend for those particulars of how legitimate faith plays out. Some contend in a manner that is hurtful and inconsiderate, not speaking the truth in love, and others contend sincerely with love mixed in to their conscientious sparring. So in the case at hand for this thread, some of the rules, no matter how well intended, become a vehicle to paint up a pig on the outside (or as Jesus said..."beautify the outside while inside you're white washed tombs" Matt 23:27). Summing that up, it's a false dichotomy to say that we should only be against the abortionists and T of LGNTQIA+ (and other similarly explicitly clear works of the devil). False doctrine of the kind that enslaves people to manmade rules and hypocrisy (as you noted with your example about pastoral immorality) is exactly what Jesus railed against the loudest when he walked the earth.
 
Here's a perspective from somebody on the left (ie, no "axe to grind" with MLK) that validates his liberal penchant. Social justice and liberal education definitely clouded his vision of what we know to be standard evangelical doctrines that stem from a literalist understanding of fundamental theological doctrines (like inerrancy).
I have heard that many fundamental bible colleges and seminaries back in his day would never allow a black man to attend and receive an education from their institutions. Liberal institutions, however, welcomed him with open arms! I wouldn't want MLK to change anything related to his "Civil Rights" message but I cannot help but think what the world would be like today had his theology been more like that of Voddie Baucham and he actually preached the Gospel?
I started to link to this article, which is a white dude who has particular bias in favor of social justice and ironically a seminary student at a doctrinally conservative/reformed evangelical school in MS, but the other one answered your query a bit better.
MLK did not reject liberal theology! The title of Alex Wright's article is completely misleading. Perhaps he rejected the full on Pelagianism that Rauschenbusch and other liberals espoused but he kept pretty much everything else! There are many preaching "Black Liberation Theology" that staunchly believe in the total depravity of the WHITE MAN and that "White man is the DEVIL!"

There are some in the comment section of this article who have pointed out Alex's shortcomings of his position who remind us that once upon a time, there once was a thriving black economy where black businesses were thriving and they did not need the white folks help! One mentioned a the Greenwood District in Tulsa, OK where whites rioted and pretty much burned the place down. Very shameful but the affluent Black community rebuilt it back! It was the shameful behavior of white supremacists that laid the groundwork for the more radical SJWs of the Civil Rights movement. I wonder what the United States would look like today had the influences of men like Booker T. Washington prevailed over men like W.E.B DuBois? Perhaps you would have such affluence in the black community where they could extend kindness to less fortunate folks in the white community and "heap coals of fire" on their heads?
 
Here's a perspective from somebody on the left (ie, no "axe to grind" with MLK) that validates his liberal penchant. Social justice and liberal education definitely clouded his vision of what we know to be standard evangelical doctrines that stem from a literalist understanding of fundamental theological doctrines (like inerrancy).
I know we had previously discussed the brand of Baptist that President Carter belongs to. Would you classify MLK as being in a similar vein as Carter? (I’m not talking about political views here, just theological.)
 
I know we had previously discussed the brand of Baptist that President Carter belongs to. Would you classify MLK as being in a similar vein as Carter? (I’m not talking about political views here, just theological.)
Very likely yes to both.
 
I know we had previously discussed the brand of Baptist that President Carter belongs to. Would you classify MLK as being in a similar vein as Carter? (I’m not talking about political views here, just theological.)
Short answer, yep. What interests you about their religious intersection? Do you think there are religious similarities and if so, how?
 
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