FBCH calls another Jack . . .

[christundivided]

I wasn't very encouraged when I read the weekend after his 17 year old son got killed in car wreck he preaches "God doesn't make any mistakes".....

Sounds like he was more concerned about putting forth what he considered a "proper imagine" than actually grieving for his son. I can tell you I couldn't do it. Not for a moment and it doesn't have anything to do with NOT believing God gets everything right. I can't understand the ego of some so called "men of God"..... and to even wear such a thing as a "badge of service"?????

I personally know a evangelist that's been preaching almost every week for more than 20 years and his son got killed in a truck accident. Even he didn't have the heart to "preach" the next sermon on his "list". Sometimes things just HURT. We are not super human. Its not about believing God. Its not about having FAITH. Sometimes you just have to let yourself grieve. Wounds often need TIME to heal. I'm SURE he is proud of himself for doing it.

Pardon me if I judge your judgmentalism, but that is somewhat over the top.  You have no idea what was going on inside him, or of the Holy Spirit's influence in his decision-making.  All you know is the standard you would set for yourself, and that is the standard he is held to.  Wow!  Just wow!

Anchor saved me the trouble of typing it...

Who said he was following the Holy Spirit? Surely you've learned by now that not everyone that says they are following the "Holy Spirit" is actually doing so??? In fact, how about using a little common sense? If God lead Israel to mourn 30 days for the death of Moses..... wouldn't you think a man's own son who be worth at least that? Mourning doesn't destroy our faith. How about reading Romans 12:15 again? The silliness associated with such beliefs are nauseating.

 

[Anchor]

Who said he was following the Holy Spirit? Surely you've learned by now that not everyone that says they are following the "Holy Spirit" is actually doing so??? In fact, how about using a little common sense? If God lead Israel to mourn 30 days for the death of Moses..... wouldn't you think a man's own son who be worth at least that? Mourning doesn't destroy our faith. How about reading Romans 12:15 again? The silliness associated with such beliefs are nauseating.

The God that led Israel to mourn 30 days for Moses is the same God that forbade Aaron from mourning for his sons (Lev. 10:1-6) and Ezekiel from mourning for his wife (Ezek. 24:15-18). You know nothing of that which you speak. The Holy Spirit that indwells you is the same Holy Spirit that indwells him. It is time to learn to trust the Holy Spirit in the life of the other person.

 

[christundivided]

Who said he was following the Holy Spirit? Surely you've learned by now that not everyone that says they are following the "Holy Spirit" is actually doing so??? In fact, how about using a little common sense? If God lead Israel to mourn 30 days for the death of Moses..... wouldn't you think a man's own son who be worth at least that? Mourning doesn't destroy our faith. How about reading Romans 12:15 again? The silliness associated with such beliefs are nauseating.

The God that led Israel to mourn 30 days for Moses is the same God that forbade Aaron from mourning for his sons (Lev. 10:1-6) and Ezekiel from mourning for his wife (Ezek. 24:15-18). You know nothing of that which you speak. The Holy Spirit that indwells you is the same Holy Spirit that indwells him. It is time to learn to trust the Holy Spirit in the life of the other person.

There was A REASON for Aaron's sons and Ezekiel's wife. I hope you're not saying THE SAME REASON is true for this man's son?

I trust the Holy Spirit. Its people I don't trust. When I hear the words "God lead me to do".... such and such... I get very suspicious. Oh the blame God receives for the silly actions of others. I very seldom ever say "God lead me to do" anything. First, if He did... Its between me and him. NOT ANYONE else.

If I'm right.... It doesn't matter than I am right. If I'm wrong then my foolishness doesn't reflect on God's own divine action.

 

[Frag]

I wasn't very encouraged when I read the weekend after his 17 year old son got killed in car wreck he preaches "God doesn't make any mistakes".....

Sounds like he was more concerned about putting forth what he considered a "proper imagine" than actually grieving for his son. I can tell you I couldn't do it. Not for a moment and it doesn't have anything to do with NOT believing God gets everything right. I can't understand the ego of some so called "men of God"..... and to even wear such a thing as a "badge of service"?????

I personally know a evangelist that's been preaching almost every week for more than 20 years and his son got killed in a truck accident. Even he didn't have the heart to "preach" the next sermon on his "list". Sometimes things just HURT. We are not super human. Its not about believing God. Its not about having FAITH. Sometimes you just have to let yourself grieve. Wounds often need TIME to heal. I'm SURE he is proud of himself for doing it.

I also wonder if perhaps preaching was his way of dealing with it.

What a way to deal with grief..... Even if was.... you don't brag about it or let someone else use it as a means to promote your spirituality or their good choice.

Wow.  So you can look into his heart?  Of all the things to criticize a man for, you have found a new low!  (and for you, that is something!)

 

[Frag]

As for FBC and their new pastor, John Wilkerson, I am praying for great days ahead -- and rooting for the church to heal and go forward.

 

[christundivided]

I wasn't very encouraged when I read the weekend after his 17 year old son got killed in car wreck he preaches "God doesn't make any mistakes".....

Sounds like he was more concerned about putting forth what he considered a "proper imagine" than actually grieving for his son. I can tell you I couldn't do it. Not for a moment and it doesn't have anything to do with NOT believing God gets everything right. I can't understand the ego of some so called "men of God"..... and to even wear such a thing as a "badge of service"?????

I personally know a evangelist that's been preaching almost every week for more than 20 years and his son got killed in a truck accident. Even he didn't have the heart to "preach" the next sermon on his "list". Sometimes things just HURT. We are not super human. Its not about believing God. Its not about having FAITH. Sometimes you just have to let yourself grieve. Wounds often need TIME to heal. I'm SURE he is proud of himself for doing it.

I also wonder if perhaps preaching was his way of dealing with it.

What a way to deal with grief..... Even if was.... you don't brag about it or let someone else use it as a means to promote your spirituality or their good choice.

Wow.  So you can look into his heart?  Of all the things to criticize a man for, you have found a new low!  (and for you, that is something!)

I didn't look into the heart of Schapp either. Didn't have to. Same thing goes here. What's in a man's heart.... comes out eventually.

Did you read Wilkerson's book? Did you read how they took their children to Saturday "soul winning meeting" right after telling their children about their brother's death? You can't make this stuff up....

Its funny how you "guys" love to judge people by their actions and then call OTHERS on it when they do it to someone you support? Can you spell the word..... Hypocrite? Or maybe Pharisee?

 

[rsc2a]

[quote author=christundivided]When I hear the words "God lead me to do".... such and such... I get very suspicious. Oh the blame God receives for the silly actions of others. I very seldom ever say "God lead me to do" anything.[/quote]

Absolutely agree.

[quote author=christundivided], if He did... Its between me and him. NOT ANYONE else.

If I'm right.... It doesn't matter than I am right. If I'm wrong then my foolishness doesn't reflect on God's own divine action.
[/quote]

Absolutely disagree.

 

[rsc2a]

[quote author=christundivided]Did you read Wilkerson's book? Did you read how they took their children to Saturday "soul winning meeting" right after telling their children about their brother's death? You can't make this stuff up....[/quote]

CU -

Some people have different ways of coping with grief. Maybe staying busy was one of their methods. It might not be how I would deal with it (then again, it might), but that doesn't make it wrong.

 

[christundivided]

Just curious why any church would seek a pastor from another successful church???

Really? Makes perfect sense to me. FBCH is all about numbers - that's how they measure success - by growth.

If Jacky The Third didn't come from a successful church, it would have been prima facie evidence that he couldn't sell FBCH's product.

Its funny to read how they are talking about "staff" down in the HAC forum. Its amazing how they throw each other "under the bus" at the average IFB church. They question why someone "didn't stand up" to someone else.... THEY KNOW THE ANSWER.... This person should get fired.... That person should get fired. They ALL should get fired. The all while... they are replaced with the same type of people. Nothing really changes.

Nobody will stand up to "Wilkerson". He'll put people around him that are nothing more than "yes men" and then He'll seek to establish his own legacy of having "saved" HAC from disaster. They'll have their annual "pastor celebrations" and everything will go on as usually.

Round and round she goes. Where she stops.... No one knows.

I bet the First Baptist Church of Long Beach didn't expect this to happen. I mean.... they have put so much into a pastor and now he is gone on to BIGGER and BETTER things. What a bunch of MALARKEY.

 

[christundivided]

[quote author=christundivided]Did you read Wilkerson's book? Did you read how they took their children to Saturday "soul winning meeting" right after telling their children about their brother's death? You can't make this stuff up....

CU -

Some people have different ways of coping with grief. Maybe staying busy was one of their methods. It might not be how I would deal with it (then again, it might), but that doesn't make it wrong.
[/quote]

My issue is with the attitude. Its all about the supposed "business of the Church". God help their children.

 

[Tarheel Baptist]

I wasn't very encouraged when I read the weekend after his 17 year old son got killed in car wreck he preaches "God doesn't make any mistakes".....

Sounds like he was more concerned about putting forth what he considered a "proper imagine" than actually grieving for his son. I can tell you I couldn't do it. Not for a moment and it doesn't have anything to do with NOT believing God gets everything right. I can't understand the ego of some so called "men of God"..... and to even wear such a thing as a "badge of service"?????

I personally know a evangelist that's been preaching almost every week for more than 20 years and his son got killed in a truck accident. Even he didn't have the heart to "preach" the next sermon on his "list". Sometimes things just HURT. We are not super human. Its not about believing God. Its not about having FAITH. Sometimes you just have to let yourself grieve. Wounds often need TIME to heal. I'm SURE he is proud of himself for doing it.

Pardon me if I judge your judgmentalism, but that is somewhat over the top.  You have no idea what was going on inside him, or of the Holy Spirit's influence in his decision-making.  All you know is the standard you would set for yourself, and that is the standard he is held to.  Wow!  Just wow!

christdivided isn't right as much as a stopped clock.

They have the same ignorant, judgemental attitude they claim to hate in the 'fundies'.....
And in Canada, John and Scott must be also known as Jack...eh?

Oh the irony...or hypocrisy as it's known in Canada!

 

[christundivided]

I wasn't very encouraged when I read the weekend after his 17 year old son got killed in car wreck he preaches "God doesn't make any mistakes".....

Sounds like he was more concerned about putting forth what he considered a "proper imagine" than actually grieving for his son. I can tell you I couldn't do it. Not for a moment and it doesn't have anything to do with NOT believing God gets everything right. I can't understand the ego of some so called "men of God"..... and to even wear such a thing as a "badge of service"?????

I personally know a evangelist that's been preaching almost every week for more than 20 years and his son got killed in a truck accident. Even he didn't have the heart to "preach" the next sermon on his "list". Sometimes things just HURT. We are not super human. Its not about believing God. Its not about having FAITH. Sometimes you just have to let yourself grieve. Wounds often need TIME to heal. I'm SURE he is proud of himself for doing it.

Pardon me if I judge your judgmentalism, but that is somewhat over the top.  You have no idea what was going on inside him, or of the Holy Spirit's influence in his decision-making.  All you know is the standard you would set for yourself, and that is the standard he is held to.  Wow!  Just wow!

christdivided and r2d2 aren't right as much as a stopped clock.

They have the same ignorant, judgemental attitude they claim to hate in the 'fundies'.....
And in Canada, John and Scott must be also known as Jack...eh?

Oh the irony...or hypocrisy as it's known in Canada!

and.....YOU'RE DISPLAYING WHAT EXACTLY?

Admit it. I have your "number" there Tarheel. I know it hurts but make sure you don't get TOO bothered by it. I'm sure if your son dies tonight, BY THE GRACE OF GOD, you'll show up for soul-winning tomorrow and drag your other children along.

If you can do THAT.... little old me shouldn't get you TOO upset.

 

[Tarheel Baptist]

I wasn't very encouraged when I read the weekend after his 17 year old son got killed in car wreck he preaches "God doesn't make any mistakes".....

Sounds like he was more concerned about putting forth what he considered a "proper imagine" than actually grieving for his son. I can tell you I couldn't do it. Not for a moment and it doesn't have anything to do with NOT believing God gets everything right. I can't understand the ego of some so called "men of God"..... and to even wear such a thing as a "badge of service"?????

I personally know a evangelist that's been preaching almost every week for more than 20 years and his son got killed in a truck accident. Even he didn't have the heart to "preach" the next sermon on his "list". Sometimes things just HURT. We are not super human. Its not about believing God. Its not about having FAITH. Sometimes you just have to let yourself grieve. Wounds often need TIME to heal. I'm SURE he is proud of himself for doing it.

Pardon me if I judge your judgmentalism, but that is somewhat over the top.  You have no idea what was going on inside him, or of the Holy Spirit's influence in his decision-making.  All you know is the standard you would set for yourself, and that is the standard he is held to.  Wow!  Just wow!

christdivided and r2d2 aren't right as much as a stopped clock.

They have the same ignorant, judgemental attitude they claim to hate in the 'fundies'.....
And in Canada, John and Scott must be also known as Jack...eh?

Oh the irony...or hypocrisy as it's known in Canada!

and.....YOU'RE DISPLAYING WHAT EXACTLY?

Admit it. I have your "number" there Tarheel. I know it hurts but make sure you don't get TOO bothered by it. I'm sure if your son dies tonight, BY THE GRACE OF GOD, you'll show up for soul-winning tomorrow and drag your other children along.

If you can do THAT.... little old me shouldn't get you TOO upset.

Upset! Please!
And I'm showing that I know hypocrisy when I see it!
Your spiritual gifts are judgement and ignorance.....yo mama be proud, fo shizzle.....

 

[Tarheel Baptist]

I wasn't very encouraged when I read the weekend after his 17 year old son got killed in car wreck he preaches "God doesn't make any mistakes".....

Sounds like he was more concerned about putting forth what he considered a "proper imagine" than actually grieving for his son. I can tell you I couldn't do it. Not for a moment and it doesn't have anything to do with NOT believing God gets everything right. I can't understand the ego of some so called "men of God"..... and to even wear such a thing as a "badge of service"?????

I personally know a evangelist that's been preaching almost every week for more than 20 years and his son got killed in a truck accident. Even he didn't have the heart to "preach" the next sermon on his "list". Sometimes things just HURT. We are not super human. Its not about believing God. Its not about having FAITH. Sometimes you just have to let yourself grieve. Wounds often need TIME to heal. I'm SURE he is proud of himself for doing it.

Pardon me if I judge your judgmentalism, but that is somewhat over the top.  You have no idea what was going on inside him, or of the Holy Spirit's influence in his decision-making.  All you know is the standard you would set for yourself, and that is the standard he is held to.  Wow!  Just wow!

You do know his spiritual gift is ignorance?

 

[ALAYMAN]

lol, I see that CU still hasn't learned the "better to be thought a fool" proverb yet. 



I don't know the context of the new pastor's return to the pulpit so shortly after his son's death, but as rsc2a said, people grieve in different ways.  On the other hand, if his quick return to the pulpit was somehow used to beat the sheep over the head so that they would emulate his "the show must go on at all costs" example when they were in dark times, then I would take exception with his motive and purpose.

 

[rsc2a]

[quote author=Tarheel Baptist]christdivided and r2d2 aren't right as much as a stopped clock.

They have the same ignorant, judgemental attitude they claim to hate in the 'fundies'.....
And in Canada, John and Scott must be also known as Jack...eh?

Oh the irony...or hypocrisy as it's known in Canada![/quote]

What in the world are you talking about? Please point to the post where I've said anything like this.

 

[rsc2a]

[quote author=ALAYMAN]On the other hand, if his quick return to the pulpit was somehow used to beat the sheep over the head so that they would emulate his "the show must go on at all costs" example when they were in dark times, then I would take exception with his motive and purpose.[/quote]

*nods*

 

[Tarheel Baptist]

[quote author=Tarheel Baptist]christdivided and r2d2 aren't right as much as a stopped clock.

They have the same ignorant, judgemental attitude they claim to hate in the 'fundies'.....
And in Canada, John and Scott must be also known as Jack...eh?

Oh the irony...or hypocrisy as it's known in Canada!

What in the world are you talking about? Please point to the post where I've said anything like this.
[/quote]

You are right, I misread the posts....I was on my phone, can't see well and I'm ignorant!
Forgive me....I'll edit my post....your posts on the issue were spot on...at least IMO!

Again, sorry!

 

[Tarheel Baptist]

lol, I see that CU still hasn't learned the "better to be thought a fool" proverb yet. 



I don't know the context of the new pastor's return to the pulpit so shortly after his son's death, but as rsc2a said, people grieve in different ways.  On the other hand, if his quick return to the pulpit was somehow used to beat the sheep over the head so that they would emulate his "the show must go on at all costs" example when they were in dark times, then I would take exception with his motive and purpose.

I'm surprised and puzzled that his quick return to the pulpit would open him to criticism....from someone other than CU

I have known Pastors who preached at he funeral of their lost children and wives as well as in the next Sunday's services. It served as part of their grieving process! I've also known those who weren't able to function under similar circumstances. Not right or wrong....just different!

 

[christundivided]

lol, I see that CU still hasn't learned the "better to be thought a fool" proverb yet. 



I don't know the context of the new pastor's return to the pulpit so shortly after his son's death, but as rsc2a said, people grieve in different ways.  On the other hand, if his quick return to the pulpit was somehow used to beat the sheep over the head so that they would emulate his "the show must go on at all costs" example when they were in dark times, then I would take exception with his motive and purpose.

What do you think the book is all about? Read... it might help you a little. You can google it and read good portion of it on a Google Books.

I loved the part about not letting the devil get the advantage by doing everything as normal....