Zimmerman case

[graceandtruth]

TM's reaction was different than G&T's, because they are spiritually very different.  TM was an evil person, a drug dealer, a rebellious youth, and deserving of death....according to the Law of God.
G&T is  a law- abiding citizen, a Pastor, a child of God.
The moment TM assaulted GZ, the case went from harrassment  to assault with deadly intent.
What we don't have, is audio of the racist epithets that TM hurled, as he tried to beat GZ to death, the violent threatenings, the aggressive, hateful, savage attitude.
I have been there, but I didn't shoot my way out.  I pastored in Englewood, Chicago, IL.  I have been assaulted, and had my life verbally threatened several times, by young bastards, with no respect for authority....for good reason, they've had no father.
This is sad all of the way around, but the bottom line is: TM threatened GZ's life, and GZ only bothered TM.  One is annoying, the other is illegal.  One deserves instruction, training, maybe even fines; The other deserves death.
Florida won't miss another dead thug...ugly truth.

Sent from my N860 using Tapatalk 2

Your post is laughable Prophet.  I do not remember any indications that he was a drug dealer with a pocket full of rocks when they found his dead body.  Since he was at his father's house and his mother and father have been divorced he was probably not a bastard.  I do not think the penalty for carrying skittles and ice tea or even drugs is death in the America or any biblical text.

The fact that you were assaulted does not give you the right to declare open season on young African-American males. 

You really give me too much credit.  If Zimmerman had continued to approach me after I warned him to stop his pursuit, I would have probably spanked him as well.  The difference is that I would have been expecting him to have a gun and he would not be here to spin his tale of "the poor white victim of black aggression" that was a result of his stupidity.

Your post to my friend reveals why the racial divide remains just as wide as it always has in America and in the churches.  You should be thankful that Paul did not just look at the aggressive, dope using/peddling, immoral bastards that were the makeup of Europe and say they deserve to die and the world is better off without them but instead he was guided by the Spirit of God to bring the Gospel to them.  Even after these violent, immoral, druggy, bastards stoned him and left him for dead.  Your form of American Christianity is unrecognizable when juxtaposed with the Christianity of Scripture.

I have a pastor friend who was hit in the head with a bat by some young African-American males while out on visitation in their neighborhood.  He was hospitalized and almost died.  His reaction was totally different than yours.  His wife and he reached out to the families of the young men after they were arrested.  One of the mothers has come to Christ and attends the church he pastors.  He has returned to the neighborhood with the Gospel and God has used him in the lives of the people in that area.  He seems to be following the example of Scripture and it seems to be working.  Imagine that.

 

[Castor Muscular]

Castor if I feel my life is threatened I have to wait until I am bleeding before I can do anything to prevent someone from harming me?  You are saying someone follows you in a truck and then starts pursuing you on foot and you don't feel threatened or you wait until he carries out his plan before you do anything to defend yourself.  Come on.........You really don't expect me to believe that?

I don't care what you believe.  There's no legal defense for attacking a follower because you feel threatened by having someone follow you.  There's no such thing as initiating an attack in self defense (unless the other person is invading your home, in which case he would be threatening your life and property by invading -- but this was out in public). 

According to your logic, Trayvon could have pulled out a gun and shot Zimmerman for the crime of what?  Following him?  That's your idea of self-defense? 

I couldn't care less if Trayvon felt threatened.  If Trayvon attacked Zimmerman first, and Zimmerman killed him in self-defense, then Trayvon was legally wrong, and Zimmerman was legally right.  If you can't see that, perhaps you're blinded by the simple fact that Trayvon was black.  In which case, you're being a racist. 

 

[graceandtruth]

TM's reaction was different than G&T's, because they are spiritually very different.  TM was an evil person, a drug dealer, a rebellious youth, and deserving of death....according to the Law of God.
G&T is  a law- abiding citizen, a Pastor, a child of God.
The moment TM assaulted GZ, the case went from harrassment  to assault with deadly intent.
What we don't have, is audio of the racist epithets that TM hurled, as he tried to beat GZ to death, the violent threatenings, the aggressive, hateful, savage attitude.
I have been there, but I didn't shoot my way out.  I pastored in Englewood, Chicago, IL.  I have been assaulted, and had my life verbally threatened several times, by young bastards, with no respect for authority....for good reason, they've had no father.
This is sad all of the way around, but the bottom line is: TM threatened GZ's life, and GZ only bothered TM.  One is annoying, the other is illegal.  One deserves instruction, training, maybe even fines; The other deserves death.
Florida won't miss another dead thug...ugly truth.

Sent from my N860 using Tapatalk 2

But he bought skittles, so that gave him the right to be a thug!

 

[graceandtruth]

TM's reaction was different than G&T's, because they are spiritually very different.  TM was an evil person, a drug dealer, a rebellious youth, and deserving of death....according to the Law of God.
G&T is  a law- abiding citizen, a Pastor, a child of God.
The moment TM assaulted GZ, the case went from harrassment  to assault with deadly intent.
What we don't have, is audio of the racist epithets that TM hurled, as he tried to beat GZ to death, the violent threatenings, the aggressive, hateful, savage attitude.
I have been there, but I didn't shoot my way out.  I pastored in Englewood, Chicago, IL.  I have been assaulted, and had my life verbally threatened several times, by young bastards, with no respect for authority....for good reason, they've had no father.
This is sad all of the way around, but the bottom line is: TM threatened GZ's life, and GZ only bothered TM.  One is annoying, the other is illegal.  One deserves instruction, training, maybe even fines; The other deserves death.
Florida won't miss another dead thug...ugly truth.

Sent from my N860 using Tapatalk 2

But he bought skittles, so that gave him the right to be a thug!

qwerty you do realize that having an empty bag that appeared to have contained marijuana in your book bag does not a thug make.  Taking a picture with your middle fingers sticking up does not a thug make.  Wearing a hoodie does not a thug make.  Being black and young and not running from someone who is stalking you does not a thug make. 

I do not look anything like what would make you think I am a "thug" but I can tell you that I would not run from anyone who has been following me around and then gets out of his vehicle and then begins to pursue me on foot.  It is just much easier to defend yourself when you are not out of breath and you are facing the person.  I would also not wait for him to initiate aggression if he continued to approach me.  His continuing to approach me after I warn him to stop would be his act of aggression.  I would not let anyone detain or interrogate me if I am not on their private property. 

This is not rocket science.  An unarmed 17 year old is dead because an adult initiated contact with him and shot him when he had no legal right to.  Forgive me if we do not see our children as monsters but as children and love them.

 

[graceandtruth]

TM's reaction was different than G&T's, because they are spiritually very different.  TM was an evil person, a drug dealer, a rebellious youth, and deserving of death....according to the Law of God.
G&T is  a law- abiding citizen, a Pastor, a child of God.
The moment TM assaulted GZ, the case went from harrassment  to assault with deadly intent.
What we don't have, is audio of the racist epithets that TM hurled, as he tried to beat GZ to death, the violent threatenings, the aggressive, hateful, savage attitude.
I have been there, but I didn't shoot my way out.  I pastored in Englewood, Chicago, IL.  I have been assaulted, and had my life verbally threatened several times, by young bastards, with no respect for authority....for good reason, they've had no father.
This is sad all of the way around, but the bottom line is: TM threatened GZ's life, and GZ only bothered TM.  One is annoying, the other is illegal.  One deserves instruction, training, maybe even fines; The other deserves death.
Florida won't miss another dead thug...ugly truth.

Sent from my N860 using Tapatalk 2

This post made me laugh because it is so IFB.  Now come on guys.  Who will be the first to forbid the madness of the prophet?

 

[rsc2a]

TM's reaction was different than G&T's, because they are spiritually very different.  TM was an evil person, a drug dealer, a rebellious youth, and deserving of death....according to the Law of God.
G&T is  a law- abiding citizen, a Pastor, a child of God.
The moment TM assaulted GZ, the case went from harrassment  to assault with deadly intent.
What we don't have, is audio of the racist epithets that TM hurled, as he tried to beat GZ to death, the violent threatenings, the aggressive, hateful, savage attitude.
I have been there, but I didn't shoot my way out.  I pastored in Englewood, Chicago, IL.  I have been assaulted, and had my life verbally threatened several times, by young bastards, with no respect for authority....for good reason, they've had no father.
This is sad all of the way around, but the bottom line is: TM threatened GZ's life, and GZ only bothered TM.  One is annoying, the other is illegal.  One deserves instruction, training, maybe even fines; The other deserves death.
Florida won't miss another dead thug...ugly truth.

Wow.... 

You sure were able to clarify what really happened. You didn't even have to use facts to do it.  :-\

 

[rsc2a]

[quote author=Castor Muscular]If Zimmerman had attacked Trayvon first, Trayvon would have some bruises or other signs of the struggle, and then he'd have died from the gunshot and Zimmerman wouldn't have a scratch on him.  Obviously, that's not what happened. [/quote]

I don't think it's that obvious, thus the debate.

[quote author=Castor Muscular]That doesn't sound like Trayvon just stood his ground.  It sounds like Trayvon attacked Zimmerman and Zimmerman defended himself.  That puts Trayvon in the wrong, and Zimmerman in the right, legally.
[/quote]

This is my thoughts, but it's also based on what I know are biased (from both sides) media reports. I just hope the jury is able to put this behind them and judge the case based on the merits instead of on the emotion.

(I also think there needs to be consideration that Trayvon may have felt provoked by Zimmerman. Does this give Trayvon the right to pound Zimmerman (if that is what, in fact, happened)? No...but it does place some of the culpability for the altercation on Zimmerman. Is it still "stand your ground" if you provoke the other guy into attacking you (even if that is not the appropriate response)?)

 

[Castor Muscular]

This is my thoughts, but it's also based on what I know are biased (from both sides) media reports.

Media bias?  Naaaah.

 

[graceandtruth]

This is my thoughts, but it's also based on what I know are biased (from both sides) media reports.

Media bias?  Naaaah.

For church bias it appears the pictures are reversed.  Too funny..........

 

[rsc2a]

This is my thoughts, but it's also based on what I know are biased (from both sides) media reports.

Media bias?  Naaaah.

(picture)

I would agree that part of the media is portraying it that way. I would also say that another part of the media is treating Zimmerman like the next Mother Teresa and Martin like he founded and leads MS-13.

 

[HeDied4U]

No lashing out just sharing the other side of the story.

Trayvon's girlfriend said that he was talking on the phone telling her that this guy was following him.  He is 17 and an adult is following him around in the dark don't you think that might be a little unnerving?  The guy has been following him in the vehicle and then gets out and approaches him on foot what should he do?  Offer him skittles and ice tea?  Come on?

Let's be realistic.  If you were walking through a neighborhood and someone was following you around in their vehicle for some time.  They then exit the vehicle and start to pursue you in the dark.  What do you do?  Let's be honest.  You don't know the guy.  You don't know if he has friends coming to help him.  You don't know if he is armed.  What do you do? 

Let me let you in on a little ethnic secret.  If an African-American male feels threatened he will usually not run.  He will stand his ground.  If you initiate the situation and depend on fear to control the situation you will find that you have miscalculated.  Why is it so hard to understand that an African-American youth would defend himself when he felt he was in danger with his hands but not hard to believe that Zimmerman would defend himself when he found he had bitten off more than he could chew.  America is still a very dangerous place for an African-American male because of situations like this.

I must confess I did not expect this response from Christians but my wife always tells me that I am a little too trusting.

IF he felt unnerved (and we may never know if he was or not), why didn't he hang up on his girlfriend and call the police and tell them he was being followed through the neighborhood by an adult and that he felt frightened/scared/unnerved? Could very well have saved his life.

Why didn't Zimmerman do the same?  That's right the law enforcement personnel had already told him not to approach the young man that he was stalking through the neighborhood.  Sorry but telling your girlfriend, "I am scarred of this man that is following me (in my little girl voice)" is not normal at all.  Too funny..........

Nothing funny at all about it. Yeah, Zimmerman didn't follow what the police told him to do, but you would think that a 17 year old kid would have sense enough to call the police IF he was afraid because an adult was following him, like he told his girlfriend he was being followed. It's been a long time since I was 17, but if I was being followed, I'd certainly call the police. Maybe common sense isn't as prevalent among teenagers as it was 30 years ago.

 

[Castor Muscular]

I would agree that part of the media is portraying it that way. I would also say that another part of the media is treating Zimmerman like the next Mother Teresa and Martin like he founded and leads MS-13.

I guess I missed the latter.  The only biased media reports I've seen were those where they used a very old picture of Trayvon, where he looks very young and innocent, and a picture of Zimmerman scowling and looking evil. 

This is a more recent picture of Trayvon circulated almost entirely independent of the media. 

Or mocking the media:

Finally, I almost never saw the pictures of Zimmerman with a bloodied nose and rear head injuries. 

I saw the unflattering pictures of Trayvon on Facebook, etc., but never in the media.

 

[graceandtruth]

No lashing out just sharing the other side of the story.

Trayvon's girlfriend said that he was talking on the phone telling her that this guy was following him.  He is 17 and an adult is following him around in the dark don't you think that might be a little unnerving?  The guy has been following him in the vehicle and then gets out and approaches him on foot what should he do?  Offer him skittles and ice tea?  Come on?

Let's be realistic.  If you were walking through a neighborhood and someone was following you around in their vehicle for some time.  They then exit the vehicle and start to pursue you in the dark.  What do you do?  Let's be honest.  You don't know the guy.  You don't know if he has friends coming to help him.  You don't know if he is armed.  What do you do? 

Let me let you in on a little ethnic secret.  If an African-American male feels threatened he will usually not run.  He will stand his ground.  If you initiate the situation and depend on fear to control the situation you will find that you have miscalculated.  Why is it so hard to understand that an African-American youth would defend himself when he felt he was in danger with his hands but not hard to believe that Zimmerman would defend himself when he found he had bitten off more than he could chew.  America is still a very dangerous place for an African-American male because of situations like this.

I must confess I did not expect this response from Christians but my wife always tells me that I am a little too trusting.

IF he felt unnerved (and we may never know if he was or not), why didn't he hang up on his girlfriend and call the police and tell them he was being followed through the neighborhood by an adult and that he felt frightened/scared/unnerved? Could very well have saved his life.

Why didn't Zimmerman do the same?  That's right the law enforcement personnel had already told him not to approach the young man that he was stalking through the neighborhood.  Sorry but telling your girlfriend, "I am scarred of this man that is following me (in my little girl voice)" is not normal at all.  Too funny..........

Nothing funny at all about it. Yeah, Zimmerman didn't follow what the police told him to do, but you would think that a 17 year old kid would have sense enough to call the police IF he was afraid because an adult was following him, like he told his girlfriend he was being followed. It's been a long time since I was 17, but if I was being followed, I'd certainly call the police. Maybe common sense isn't as prevalent among teenagers as it was 30 years ago.

Let me help you understand that it has nothing to do with common sense.

When I was 17 I was an honors student.  I was not a thug.  If Zimmerman had been following me and then got out his truck to pursue me on a public street.  I would have warned him to stop and if he didn't then I would not have called the police or told my girlfriend that I was scarred because by the time police would arrive sweet little ole Zimmerman could have done anything that he intended to do me.  If he continued to pursue me until he got close enough to touch me I would have spanked him as well.  He was stalking me and now his is pursuing me on foot and I warn him to stop and he continues then he clearly wants to be unpleasantly surprised.

It is really simple.  Because I am and African-American male does not give someone the right to follow me or interrogate me on public property or violate law enforcement instructions to not approach me.  It also does not give you the right to take my life because you don't want the whipping that you have forced me to give you.  Zimmerman cannot begin as the "strong arm of the law" and then transform into a scared little girl when his victim becomes a victor.

 

[qwerty]

Zimmerman should have bought skittles first, then he would have had the right......

 

[Castor Muscular]

It is really simple.  Because I am and African-American male does not give someone the right to follow me or interrogate me on public property or violate law enforcement instructions to not approach me.

Now you're just making things up, which shows just how desperate and racist you are being.  Nobody knows yet if Zimmerman interrogated Trayvon (there have been ZERO reports of any such thing), and law enforcement didn't forbid Zimmerman to follow Trayvon. 

It also does not give you the right to take my life because you don't want the whipping that you have forced me to give you.  Zimmerman cannot begin as the "strong arm of the law" and then transform into a scared little girl when his victim becomes a victor.

Yeah, following someone forces them to give you a whipping.  You're sick, man. 

 

[cave_dweller]

It is really simple.  Because I am and African-American male does not give someone the right to follow me or interrogate me on public property or violate law enforcement instructions to not approach me.

Now you're just making things up, which shows just how desperate and racist you are being.  Nobody knows yet if Zimmerman interrogated Trayvon (there have been ZERO reports of any such thing), and law enforcement didn't forbid Zimmerman to follow Trayvon. 

It also does not give you the right to take my life because you don't want the whipping that you have forced me to give you.  Zimmerman cannot begin as the "strong arm of the law" and then transform into a scared little girl when his victim becomes a victor.

Yeah, following someone forces them to give you a whipping.  You're sick, man.

Ouch!

 

[graceandtruth]

I would agree that part of the media is portraying it that way. I would also say that another part of the media is treating Zimmerman like the next Mother Teresa and Martin like he founded and leads MS-13.

I guess I missed the latter.  The only biased media reports I've seen were those where they used a very old picture of Trayvon, where he looks very young and innocent, and a picture of Zimmerman scowling and looking evil. 

This is a more recent picture of Trayvon circulated almost entirely independent of the media. 

Or mocking the media:

Finally, I almost never saw the pictures of Zimmerman with a bloodied nose and rear head injuries. 

I saw the unflattering pictures of Trayvon on Facebook, etc., but never in the media.

Taking a picture in a mirror no more makes you a thug than shooting the bird at someone in your rear view mirror.  It's laughable that a Zimmerman let a little boy like that bloody his nose.  He should have been home and sent his wife out on neighborhood watch.

Do you have any pictures of Trayvon's fatal gunshot wound that you could put up next to Zimmerman's scratch and bloody nose so we can see the whole picture? 

Too funny ......... 

You definitely have not deserted you IFB roots. LOL........Too funny.......

 

[rsc2a]

[quote author=Castor Muscular]I saw the unflattering pictures of Trayvon on Facebook, etc., but never in the media.
[/quote]

1 - Facebook, etc is a form of media.

2 - Conservative media types (e.g. Hannity et al) were showing some of the same pictures you just provided.

 

[graceandtruth]

It is really simple.  Because I am and African-American male does not give someone the right to follow me or interrogate me on public property or violate law enforcement instructions to not approach me.

Now you're just making things up, which shows just how desperate and racist you are being.  Nobody knows yet if Zimmerman interrogated Trayvon (there have been ZERO reports of any such thing), and law enforcement didn't forbid Zimmerman to follow Trayvon. 

It also does not give you the right to take my life because you don't want the whipping that you have forced me to give you.  Zimmerman cannot begin as the "strong arm of the law" and then transform into a scared little girl when his victim becomes a victor.

Yeah, following someone forces them to give you a whipping.  You're sick, man.

Ouch!

No ouch.  I am simply telling you what I would have done him at 17.  Now that I am a believer I would try to prevent that but I would not let him get close enough to me to touch me under any conditions.  He has been following me around stalking me from his vehicle.  That's sick.  So I don't know what his intentions are but normal people don't stalk people from their vehicle and then get out to pursue them on foot to shake their hand.

I'm sorry but where I live the dispatchers for the 911 system are part of the deputy sheriff system and are considered law enforcement agents complete with badges and guns. 

 

[Castor Muscular]

[quote author=Castor Muscular]I saw the unflattering pictures of Trayvon on Facebook, etc., but never in the media.

1 - Facebook, etc is a form of media.

2 - Conservative media types (e.g. Hannity et al) were showing some of the same pictures you just provided.
[/quote]

Facebook is not the news media.  I believe you re: Hannity, but I don't like or watch Hannity, so I wouldn't have seen it.