The Decline of the IFB Movement?

[Bob H]

Who are today's IFB leaders who have influence outside of a sphere of 75-100 churches?
And are there any IFB mega churches less than 20 years old?

In fact, how many IFB mega churches exist today...period?

A mega church is over 2000 in attendance, at least that's how I think it's defined.
I ask just as a gage of the growth of the movement, not to say thats a sign of success.

I believe our movement is in decline and has been for some time.
What do you think?
Why or why not?


I also posted this on the other forum, in the interest of full disclosure.

Let me get this straight, you're saying that there are less Independent baptist cause there are less baptist "mega" churches?

 

[Fresh Air]

I would not use the word "decline".  I believe the IFB movement has evolved.  Yes, in the 60s/70s we allowed ourselves to be defined by a handful of mega ministries and conferences.  Sadly (but not surprisingly since we were more personality driven than Christ driven) the 80s and 90s were marred by some major and very public scandles, needless inner fighting and some extremism.  The result was two-fold:  some left the "movement", compromised and became evangelicals.  Others just decided to truly become "independent, fundamental baptist".  Those of us who chose the latter, still stand strong on what we always considered important, but simply "checked out" of the silly politics.  A few national conferences have been replaced by a multitude of smaller regional gatherings, pastors are more focused on reaching their area than impressing some IFB click, many smaller, and regional IFB colleges have replaced the two or three large, colleges.  All these things are for the better!  Instead of trying to build a mega church, we are getting back to church planting. 

I believe the IFB churches (smaller in size, but many more in number and better focused on what is really important) are having a BIGGER impact now (just more quietly) than we were having in the 60s and 70s. 

People keep trying to schedule the funeral of the IFB movement -- one problem -- their ain't no corpse!  The local bodies are out running buses, soul winning, energizing their young people and reaching the world for Christ!

I don't see that as a "decline"....

what he said

 

[rsc2a]

Yes, Fundamental Baptists need to get back to the fundamentals of the faith.  Bible reading, Prayer, witnessing and loving one another.  Satan is having a party.

Those are the what you would describe as the fundamentals of the faith?  :-\

(Not that the things mentioned are necessarily bad, but that seems like an odd grouping to call "fundamentals of the faith".)

 

[El Cid]

Yes, Fundamental Baptists need to get back to the fundamentals of the faith.  Bible reading, Prayer, witnessing and loving one another.  Satan is having a party.

Those are the what you would describe as the fundamentals of the faith?  :-\

(Not that the things mentioned are necessarily bad, but that seems like an odd grouping to call "fundamentals of the faith".)

No but we as Christians need to do those things.  Sorry if you misunderstood.

 

[brianb]

In Canada and the rest of the world the IFB movement (if that is defined as more churches being planted) is growing. We've never had those IFB fellowships like BBF or GARBC that you have in the U.S so maybe that's why we've managed to keep all the problems miniscule - there maybe some bad IFB churches in Canada - I know a few have had poor histories. But so far the media hasn't singled us out. The media here lumps us with other Baptists and Evangelicals any ways.

 

[Tarheel Baptist]

I would not use the word "decline".  I believe the IFB movement has evolved.  Yes, in the 60s/70s we allowed ourselves to be defined by a handful of mega ministries and conferences.  Sadly (but not surprisingly since we were more personality driven than Christ driven) the 80s and 90s were marred by some major and very public scandles, needless inner fighting and some extremism.  The result was two-fold:  some left the "movement", compromised and became evangelicals.  Others just decided to truly become "independent, fundamental baptist".  Those of us who chose the latter, still stand strong on what we always considered important, but simply "checked out" of the silly politics.  A few national conferences have been replaced by a multitude of smaller regional gatherings, pastors are more focused on reaching their area than impressing some IFB click, many smaller, and regional IFB colleges have replaced the two or three large, colleges.  All these things are for the better!  Instead of trying to build a mega church, we are getting back to church planting. 

I believe the IFB churches (smaller in size, but many more in number and better focused on what is really important) are having a BIGGER impact now (just more quietly) than we were having in the 60s and 70s. 

People keep trying to schedule the funeral of the IFB movement -- one problem -- their ain't no corpse!  The local bodies are out running buses, soul winning, energizing their young people and reaching the world for Christ!

I don't see that as a "decline"....

I agree that the movement has evolved, and that there are still some good and growing churches in IFB-dom.

I would disagree IF you're saying that mega churches and conferences no longer have influence.
One only has to read the ads in Sword of the Lord to know better.
And, the Sword has broken fellowship with a large segment of the IFB world.

It has been a long time since I was actively involved in ANY of the IFB's factional conferences.
In fact, I stopped attending the local IFB fellowship because all I heard was what was wrong with everyone else.
If using screens and wearing ties (we do both) are core issues...if whether or not you have a BUS MINISTRY (for goodness sakes) defines a Fundamental Baptist Church, than I don't want to be in that camp.

 

[Tarheel Baptist]

Who are today's IFB leaders who have influence outside of a sphere of 75-100 churches?
And are there any IFB mega churches less than 20 years old?

In fact, how many IFB mega churches exist today...period?

A mega church is over 2000 in attendance, at least that's how I think it's defined.
I ask just as a gage of the growth of the movement, not to say thats a sign of success.

I believe our movement is in decline and has been for some time.
What do you think?
Why or why not?


I also posted this on the other forum, in the interest of full disclosure.

Let me get this straight, you're saying that there are less Independent baptist cause there are less baptist "mega" churches?

No, that not what i'm saying, but that is how the movement defined ITSELF in the hey day of the 70's.
I'm saying that the IFB movement as a whole, is smaller in numbers and influence, more isolated and less effective for the cause of Christ today than ever in my lifetime.

 

[Tarheel Baptist]

I think the IFB movement has changed as well.  Older pastors are replace by younger ones that don't care about pants on women, facial hair on men, and what version of the bible is being used in the pews.  Other denominations aren't demonized from the pulpit, and the music includes some contemporary gospel.  Powerpoint is used, as well as the internet to stream live church.  The focus is still on the word of God, and love for the brethren and the lost man is still important.

At least those are some of the trends I am seeing.

I'm  glad that's your experience.
I don't see that in the IFB movement here in NC, but I know that the BBF has taken steps in that direction.
Which led to a revolt and split in the movement.....which goes to my point.

 

[Tarheel Baptist]

Independent Baptists are Independent so there are hundreds and maybe thousands of different types of churches and so it would be difficult to paint them all with one brush.

You are exactly right, and I don't mean to do so.
I'm just looking at the 'movement' as a whole.

 

[bruinboy]

Did someone say IFB? 

 

[jbh28]

IFB churches are independent. There are a few things to keep in mind. They are all different. The name "IFB" has taken a hit in the past few years driving some churches to drop the independent baptist name. There are some IFB churches that give "IFB" a bad name. There are though some that are really good. The issue I have with some IFB churches is that they have confused biblical truth with application.  Women wearing pants would be an example.

Just be careful not to broad brush everyone under the name IFB. There are some really good ones out there.

 

[themagneticfields]

Who are today's IFB leaders who have influence outside of a sphere of 75-100 churches?
And are there any IFB mega churches less than 20 years old?

In fact, how many IFB mega churches exist today...period?

A mega church is over 2000 in attendance, at least that's how I think it's defined.
I ask just as a gage of the growth of the movement, not to say thats a sign of success.

I believe our movement is in decline and has been for some time.
What do you think?
Why or why not?


I also posted this on the other forum, in the interest of full disclosure.

Colonial Baptist in Cary, NC has about 4000 in attendance. It started about 25 years ago and the founding pastor is still the pastor.

 

[brianb]

IFB churches are independent. There are a few things to keep in mind. They are all different. The name "IFB" has taken a hit in the past few years driving some churches to drop the independent baptist name. There are some IFB churches that give "IFB" a bad name. There are though some that are really good. The issue I have with some IFB churches is that they have confused biblical truth with application.  Women wearing pants would be an example.

Just be careful not to broad brush everyone under the name IFB. There are some really good ones out there.

Ifb gets picked on I think more than say apostolics because of their belief in salvation by grace alone. Apostolics like upc add works. Every one knows about the UPC church how they dress and such but IFB is much more like the rest of Evangelicals in the essentials so they are going to be picked on more.

 

[Matthew1323]

I believe our movement is in decline and has been for some time.
What do you think?
Why or why not?

I do believe that that IFB church movement is getting stronger. Though the days of the hooping and hollering about padded attendance figures and Big Days are not over, there are many solid Christ-centered IFB churches that are doing a good work. It is sad that the loons of any group, many times, overshadow the solid faithful day-to-day service of the Christ honoring churches.

The truly Independent do not strictly attach themselves to other churches, fellowships, conferences, and colleges. I view some in the IFB movement as maturing, focusing more on Christ and His work, rather than worrying about back-patting of each other,  apparently in an effort to gain some sort of great earthly recognition or reputation.

 

[bruinboy]

Who are today's IFB leaders who have influence outside of a sphere of 75-100 churches?
And are there any IFB mega churches less than 20 years old?

In fact, how many IFB mega churches exist today...period?

A mega church is over 2000 in attendance, at least that's how I think it's defined.
I ask just as a gage of the growth of the movement, not to say thats a sign of success.

I believe our movement is in decline and has been for some time.
What do you think?
Why or why not?


I also posted this on the other forum, in the interest of full disclosure.

Colonial Baptist in Cary, NC has about 4000 in attendance. It started about 25 years ago and the founding pastor is still the pastor.

Colonial is the furthest thing from a traditional IFB church.  It is more like a Thomas Road or a Saddleback.

.

 

[Bob H]

...I'm saying that the IFB movement as a whole, is smaller in numbers and influence, more isolated and less effective for the cause of Christ today than ever in my lifetime.

That sounds like the American church in general no matter what "movement" or flavor your in. But that's just me

 

[rsc2a]

The truly Independent do not strictly attach themselves to other churches, fellowships, conferences, and colleges.

That's kinda sad. 

 

[themagneticfields]

Who are today's IFB leaders who have influence outside of a sphere of 75-100 churches?
And are there any IFB mega churches less than 20 years old?

In fact, how many IFB mega churches exist today...period?

A mega church is over 2000 in attendance, at least that's how I think it's defined.
I ask just as a gage of the growth of the movement, not to say thats a sign of success.

I believe our movement is in decline and has been for some time.
What do you think?
Why or why not?


I also posted this on the other forum, in the interest of full disclosure.

Colonial Baptist in Cary, NC has about 4000 in attendance. It started about 25 years ago and the founding pastor is still the pastor.

Colonial is the furthest thing from a traditional IFB church.  It is more like a Thomas Road or a Saddleback.

.

Anything that disqualifies it from being IFB? Maybe it is how IFB's should be.

 

[brianb]

Who are today's IFB leaders who have influence outside of a sphere of 75-100 churches?
And are there any IFB mega churches less than 20 years old?

In fact, how many IFB mega churches exist today...period?

A mega church is over 2000 in attendance, at least that's how I think it's defined.
I ask just as a gage of the growth of the movement, not to say thats a sign of success.

I believe our movement is in decline and has been for some time.
What do you think?
Why or why not?


I also posted this on the other forum, in the interest of full disclosure.

Colonial Baptist in Cary, NC has about 4000 in attendance. It started about 25 years ago and the founding pastor is still the pastor.

Colonial is the furthest thing from a traditional IFB church.  It is more like a Thomas Road or a Saddleback.

.

Anything that disqualifies it from being IFB? Maybe it is how IFB's should be.

As long as a church calls itself independent fundamental baptist it is an independent fundamental baptist (IFB church). Those three words must uttered in church by a pastor on a regular basis (at least a few times a year). It must also be on the church web site if there is one. They must only support missionaries who are planting independent fundamental baptist churches. If an IFB church member notices that the words independent fundamental baptist have not been used in a year or maybe that the church web site has removed those words chances are it is no longer an IFB church and is now merely an unaffiliated Baptist Church.

I can certainly tell what would not disqualify a church from being IFB and that is a change in Bible version. I know of a church in British Columbia that by application is very much IFB but uses the ESV as its Bible.

 

[rsc2a]

As long as a church calls itself independent fundamental baptist it is an independent fundamental baptist (IFB church). Those three words must uttered in church by a pastor on a regular basis (at least a few times a year). It must also be on the church web site if there is one. They must only support missionaries who are planting independent fundamental baptist churches. If an IFB church member notices that the words independent fundamental baptist have not been used in a year or maybe that the church web site has removed those words chances are it is no longer an IFB church and is now merely an unaffiliated Baptist Church.

And why in the world would you say this:

"They must only support missionaries who are planting independent fundamental baptist churches."