Let's Return to the Old Paths

[cpizzle]

Thank you.  I truly appreciate your response.

Again, let me get your perspective to a genuine question I don't have an answer to.

Why do you think the KJB gets lifted up as the "perfect" translation and no other translations get the same treatment.  In other words, why is their no ASV 1901 Only movement?

What led IFB leadership to the KJ over the ASV 1901 (or any other translation).  It has to be more than just age? 

 

[Twisted]

What led IFB leadership to the KJ over the ASV 1901 (or any other translation).  It has to be more than just age? 

Results.

 

[16KJV11]

What led IFB leadership to the KJ over the ASV 1901 (or any other translation).  It has to be more than just age? 

Results.

Westcott

 

[cpizzle]

What led IFB leadership to the KJ over the ASV 1901 (or any other translation).  It has to be more than just age? 

Results.

Hyles, Roloof, Rice, Robertson, ect... were all getting huge results before the KJ became an issue. 

 

[cpizzle]

What led IFB leadership to the KJ over the ASV 1901 (or any other translation).  It has to be more than just age? 

Results.

Westcott

Wescott and Hort are certainly 2 of the major reasons I use and trust the KVB exclusively.  However, I think the King James was selected as the "true" Bible before most preachers even new of the TR vs WH debate.

My question is more directly to those who believe other translations are superior to the KJ.  Why are no other translations widely accepted by modern scholarship as the "best."

 

[Twisted]

What led IFB leadership to the KJ over the ASV 1901 (or any other translation).  It has to be more than just age? 

Results.

Hyles, Roloof, Rice, Robertson, ect... were all getting huge results before the KJ became an issue.

Since when is the KJB an "issue"?  Unless you're a lib.

 

[bgwilkinson]

What led IFB leadership to the KJ over the ASV 1901 (or any other translation).  It has to be more than just age? 

Results.

Hyles, Roloof, Rice, Robertson, ect... were all getting huge results before the KJ became an issue.

The issue is not the King James Version of the Bible but rather other translations that are denigrated by the KJVO as being Satan's bibles.

That is the issue, the blasphemy of the Holy Spirit by ascribing to Satan that which was done by the Holy Spirit, the breather of the original Words of Scripture.

 

[BALAAM]

Every time I hear this 'old paths' mantra, I am always befuddled. These old paths guys claim they are the same as 100 years ago and have never changed. They talk about their honor for the 'old warriors' etc. etc. There are a few things that bother me about this.
John Rice was not KJV only.
Lee Roberson offered the use of Tennessee Temple schools to the translators on the NKJV committee. (if my reading is correct)
Spurgeon would not be allowed to preach in most of their churches today.
If old is so good, why were they called the 'roaring 20's?
Ever hear of the Wild West? There was good reason for it. Were they good because they were old?
Jack Hyles said that Hac would never offer a correspondence course and his philosophy was that a preacher needs to move away to a Bible college and be under teachers. He was not a fan of church bible institutes if I remember correctly. Every school and college needed to be under the umbrella of a local church.

I am sure that Gray believed and taught the same thing at one time. Now, he has started an on-line college in direct competition with his former college. I would bet that it is in direct contrast to what he taught in previous years but I don't know that for sure. I only know that JH could not stop walking too quickly or BG would have his nose.... well you get the picture.

Nearly everyone longs for the old days because our memories are not always 20/20.

Say not; what is the cause that the former days were better than these. For, thous dost not inquire wisely concerning this.

 

[16KJV11]

Every time I hear this 'old paths' mantra, I am always befuddled. These old paths guys claim they are the same as 100 years ago and have never changed. They talk about their honor for the 'old warriors' etc. etc. There are a few things that bother me about this.
John Rice was not KJV only.
Lee Roberson offered the use of Tennessee Temple schools to the translators on the NKJV committee. (if my reading is correct)
Spurgeon would not be allowed to preach in most of their churches today.
If old is so good, why were they called the 'roaring 20's?
Ever hear of the Wild West? There was good reason for it. Were they good because they were old?
Jack Hyles said that Hac would never offer a correspondence course and his philosophy was that a preacher needs to move away to a Bible college and be under teachers. He was not a fan of church bible institutes if I remember correctly. Every school and college needed to be under the umbrella of a local church.

I am sure that Gray believed and taught the same thing at one time. Now, he has started an on-line college in direct competition with his former college. I would bet that it is in direct contrast to what he taught in previous years but I don't know that for sure. I only know that JH could not stop walking too quickly or BG would have his nose.... well you get the picture.

Nearly everyone longs for the old days because our memories are not always 20/20.

Say not; what is the cause that the former days were better than these. For, thous dost not inquire wisely concerning this.

Wow, if it weren't for my brothes on the FFF keeping me up to date on what is going on in fundamentalism, I'd never know.  If I get any mail from BG, etc...I usually don't even look at it or take it seriously.

 

[BALAAM]

I would like to return to the Old Paths also. Back to the days when the big ifb evangelists did not constantly post pictures of themselves on Twitter with their altar calls and pictures with their converts and pictures with someone who 'raised the white flag' under his ministry.

 

[BALAAM]

This is one theme that drives me up the wall. Here is one reason. Most of these 'old paths' preachers love to quote Spurgeon and use him as an illustration, right?

We have not laboured to excite carnal passions, nor to preach sermons with a view of driving you into religious fevers. Sturdy old Calvinism will not let us do this.
Excerpt from the sermon, 'Canaan on Earth' by Spurgeon.

 

[bgwilkinson]

Charles Finney would go into an emotional fit upon reading that quote.

 

[Walt]

I would like to return to the Old Paths also. Back to the days when the big ifb evangelists did not constantly post pictures of themselves on Twitter with their altar calls and pictures with their converts and pictures with someone who 'raised the white flag' under his ministry.

In the Old Days, they would just lie about the great successes of their previous campaigns.

 

[bgwilkinson]

I would like to return to the Old Paths also. Back to the days when the big ifb evangelists did not constantly post pictures of themselves on Twitter with their altar calls and pictures with their converts and pictures with someone who 'raised the white flag' under his ministry.

In the Old Days, they would just lie about the great successes of their previous campaigns.

Stats are important for getting more speaking gigs.

 

[BALAAM]

I would like to return to the Old Paths also. Back to the days when the big ifb evangelists did not constantly post pictures of themselves on Twitter with their altar calls and pictures with their converts and pictures with someone who 'raised the white flag' under his ministry.

In the Old Days, they would just lie about the great successes of their previous campaigns.

Stats are important for getting more speaking gigs.

I am afraid this is true. But, it is also what we were taught at hac even though a lot of the evangelists did not go there. Every ministry meeting started out with 'I had this many saved and this many in the water.'

 

[bgwilkinson]

I would like to return to the Old Paths also. Back to the days when the big ifb evangelists did not constantly post pictures of themselves on Twitter with their altar calls and pictures with their converts and pictures with someone who 'raised the white flag' under his ministry.

In the Old Days, they would just lie about the great successes of their previous campaigns.

Stats are important for getting more speaking gigs.

I am afraid this is true. But, it is also what we were taught at hac even though a lot of the evangelists did not go there. Every ministry meeting started out with 'I had this many saved and this many in the water.'

Nothing more than using the methods of the "World System" to do the LORD's work. Hardly "Old Paths".

A bit like planning a revival and asking the LORD to come along and help out rather than following His leading.

Bro. Hyles greatest ability was his genius for mass marketing. When he was younger he was a paid motivational speaker like Zig Ziglar. As he got older pastors would get together and pay him to speak for them in large gatherings.
It was his marketing ability that drove increases in numbers.

 

[sword]

I would like to return to the Old Paths also. Back to the days when the big ifb evangelists did not constantly post pictures of themselves on Twitter with their altar calls and pictures with their converts and pictures with someone who 'raised the white flag' under his ministry.

In the Old Days, they would just lie about the great successes of their previous campaigns.

Stats are important for getting more speaking gigs.

I am afraid this is true. But, it is also what we were taught at hac even though a lot of the evangelists did not go there. Every ministry meeting started out with 'I had this many saved and this many in the water.'

Nothing more than using the methods of the "World System" to do the LORD's work. Hardly "Old Paths".
A bit like planning a revival and asking the LORD to come along and help out rather than following His leading.
Bro. Hyles greatest ability was his genius for mass marketing. When he was younger he was a paid motivational speaker like Zig Ziglar. As he got older pastors would get together and pay him to speak for them in large gatherings.
It was his marketing ability that drove increases in numbers.

Kinda like:

Luke 14:23  And the lord said unto the servant, Go out into the highways and hedges, and compel them to come in, that my house may be filled.

Mark 15:16 And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.

 

[TidesofTruth]

I would like to return to the Old Paths also. Back to the days when the big ifb evangelists did not constantly post pictures of themselves on Twitter with their altar calls and pictures with their converts and pictures with someone who 'raised the white flag' under his ministry.

In the Old Days, they would just lie about the great successes of their previous campaigns.

Stats are important for getting more speaking gigs.

I am afraid this is true. But, it is also what we were taught at hac even though a lot of the evangelists did not go there. Every ministry meeting started out with 'I had this many saved and this many in the water.'

Nothing more than using the methods of the "World System" to do the LORD's work. Hardly "Old Paths".
A bit like planning a revival and asking the LORD to come along and help out rather than following His leading.
Bro. Hyles greatest ability was his genius for mass marketing. When he was younger he was a paid motivational speaker like Zig Ziglar. As he got older pastors would get together and pay him to speak for them in large gatherings.
It was his marketing ability that drove increases in numbers.

Kinda like:

Luke 14:23  And the lord said unto the servant, Go out into the highways and hedges, and compel them to come in, that my house may be filled.

Mark 15:16 And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.

You may say a lot of things but you have got to give him that.  Bro. Hyles was one of the greatest compellers to have ever lived. 

 

[Walt]

I would like to return to the Old Paths also. Back to the days when the big ifb evangelists did not constantly post pictures of themselves on Twitter with their altar calls and pictures with their converts and pictures with someone who 'raised the white flag' under his ministry.

In the Old Days, they would just lie about the great successes of their previous campaigns.

Stats are important for getting more speaking gigs.

I am afraid this is true. But, it is also what we were taught at hac even though a lot of the evangelists did not go there. Every ministry meeting started out with 'I had this many saved and this many in the water.'

Indeed... a very bad habit to get into; it gives entrance to pride and comparing ourselves with others, which the Scripture declares is "not wise".  What happened to one plants the seed, another waters, and yet another sees the increase?  It is God that saves the person, and to Him goes the glory.

Sorry, you've hit a bit of hot button for me; I am VERY tired of reading on social media "We had X people out soulwinning and saw Y saved" -- no matter how it's clothed, it just looks like bragging ("my church is better than your church, as we had more people going out" -- or "my leadership is clearly better, as we had more saved").  Such posts reveal a braggadocios spirit.  I suspect that, in reality, they probably convinced "Y" people to say a prayer, but their total lack of interest in spiritual things is a good indication of the lack of new birth.  No one in the Bible had a "salvation" experience with no change.  (Some, of course, did "go back" and did not continue, but all at least made a start).

 

[Walt]

I would like to return to the Old Paths also. Back to the days when the big ifb evangelists did not constantly post pictures of themselves on Twitter with their altar calls and pictures with their converts and pictures with someone who 'raised the white flag' under his ministry.

In the Old Days, they would just lie about the great successes of their previous campaigns.

Stats are important for getting more speaking gigs.

I am afraid this is true. But, it is also what we were taught at hac even though a lot of the evangelists did not go there. Every ministry meeting started out with 'I had this many saved and this many in the water.'

Nothing more than using the methods of the "World System" to do the LORD's work. Hardly "Old Paths".
A bit like planning a revival and asking the LORD to come along and help out rather than following His leading.
Bro. Hyles greatest ability was his genius for mass marketing. When he was younger he was a paid motivational speaker like Zig Ziglar. As he got older pastors would get together and pay him to speak for them in large gatherings.
It was his marketing ability that drove increases in numbers.

Kinda like:

Luke 14:23  And the lord said unto the servant, Go out into the highways and hedges, and compel them to come in, that my house may be filled.

As I recall, this is lifted from a parable; I'm not even sure that is has anything to do with soul-winning or getting people to come to church.  Are we supposed to force people to come?  Bribe them?  Anything is justified as long as they come?

The point of the parable is that God in His mercy and grace would allow others besides His chosen people to be saved and to fill His house.

Anyone want to explain the parable and verse differently? I'm just going from memory and I could be wrong.

Mark 15:16 And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.

The world's system in this area was to pick the Great Commission and a few other verses, and strong-arm and/or shame people into going out cold-calling door-to-door, or they wouldn't be allowed to serve in any capacity in the church.  By and large, this tactic has not borne good fruit, in my opinion.