Why Do Calvinists Think They Have Superior Theology?

Ekklesian said:
You said that in his love for the vessels of wrath, he suspends His sovereignty. I'm saying that's not love.
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He allows the damned to experience good in this life. This is mercy.
I don't know how you infer "love from: "under His wrath"?!?
 
FSSL said:
All I did is quote Colossians 1 and Average Joe says that is my interpretation and you say it's presupositional and philosophical.

Reread Colossians 1 and tell us why God's Sovereignty doesnt relate to our salvation and a radical change of our wills.
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Get real! I said no such thing about SCRIPTURE! You, sir, are a prevaricator of the worst order. You know good and well that this was directed toward your comments, not the reference.
 
ALAYMAN said:
FSSL said:
ONLY a Sovereign God who is over ALL things has the authority/ability to reconcile you and make your hostile minds love Him!
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That’s not an exegetical basis for your interpretation, it’s presuppositional and philosophical.
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So there are times when "all" doesn't mean all, then?
 
Ransom said:
So there are times when "all" doesn't mean all, then?
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Good one 😊

I think context is king, and if FSSL wants to choose a different (stronger) text to argue his point I’m good with that😉
 
Ekklesian said:
You asserted that God, in love, suspends His Soveignty in salvation.
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Twice you have mischaracterized my statements. What's your angle?
I'm just here for open debate on the topic.
 
ALAYMAN said:
Good one 😊

I think context is king, and if FSSL wants to choose a different (stronger) text to argue his point I’m good with that😉
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I dont need a stronger text. This is quite clear. The very argument that Paul makes is about God's Sovereignty over all things including reconciling those who are hostile to Him.
 
prophet said:
Twice you have mischaracterized my statements. What's your angle?
I'm just here for open debate on the topic.
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Perhaps if you were more clear...

What do you mean by the following, if you don't mean that God demonstrates love in suspending His sovereignty in salvation?

prophet said:
God is The Sovereign.
But He, willing to demonstrate His glory, love, mercy, all that He is...does not yet enforce that Sovereignty fully.
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ALAYMAN said:
LOL, flesh that out if it’s so clear from verse 16. How does Christ’s sovereignty over the whole universe, kingdoms, and the earth supply the concept of sovereignty over man’s will (and don’t bring philosophic weight of other passages into the immediate text in doing so).
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Well, first, the exclusion of other passages is an invalid exclusion. Jussayin'.

But I need not go to other passages. Your use of the word, 'sovereign,' is tantamount to a capitulation to FSSLs point. The passage doesn't say Christ is 'sovereign' over all things. It says He is the creator of all things, and that all things serve Him. Sovereignty is so strongly implied as to be expressly stated, as you unwittingly admitted.

There remains only one way to sustain your premise, and that is to assert that the mind, will and emotions of man are nothing created.
 
Ekklesian said:
Perhaps if you were more clear...

What do you mean by the following, if you don't mean that God demonstrates love in suspending His sovereignty in salvation?
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In the Millennium, God will enforce His Sovereignty to a much higher degree, than He does pre-Mil. Yet, He will still allow rebellion, all along, judging the Nations with drought, when they do so.
A final rebellion, will be allowed, and Satan loosed, to recruit the last generation of the damned.
After that, a new Earth, with The New Jerusalem as Capitol, will be under His fully enforced Sovereignty, and so...Perfect!
That's what I mean.
He chose that progression, and revealed it to us.
And whom am I to question Him for that?
 
prophet said:
In the Millennium, God will enforce His Sovereignty to a much higher degree, than He does pre-Mil. Yet, He will still allow rebellion, all along, judging the Nations with drought, when they do so.
A final rebellion, will be allowed, and Satan loosed, to recruit the last generation of the damned.
After that, a new Earth, with The New Jerusalem as Capitol, will be under His fully enforced Sovereignty, and so...Perfect!
That's what I mean.
He chose that progression, and revealed it to us.
And whom am I to question Him for that?
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God never gave up one iota of His Sovereignty. Paul says all things exist because of Him.

Your definition of Sovereignty is foreign to Scripture. It assumes God is only in full control in the future. Therefore, your view of God denies His Sovereignty when Scripture never does.
 
FSSL said:
I dont need a stronger text. This is quite clear. The very argument that Paul makes is about God's Sovereignty over all things including reconciling those who are hostile to Him.
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Read this link consisting of tens of thousands of words by notable preachers and theologians, a great many of whom are Calvinists, and other than the hyper-Calvinist JC Philpot please show me from these voluminous writings/commentaries where your concept of dealing with the matter of freewill is referenced. You won’t find it, but what you will find is reams of content dealing with allusion to Christ’s supremacy, deity proclaimed, head of the church, creator and sustainer of the material world, etc (things I said the passage deals with regarding sovereignty).

I cite this as further proof of the presuppositional prooftexting and shoehorning that internet Calvinists often resort to in making the Scriptures say more than they are saying.
 
I have Scripture:

"Colossians 1:15–22 (NIV): 15 The Son is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. 16 For in him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things have been created through him and for him. 17 He is before all things, and in him all things hold together. 18 And he is the head of the body, the church; he is the beginning and the firstborn from among the dead, so that in everything he might have the supremacy. 19 For God was pleased to have all his fullness dwell in him, 20 and through him to reconcile to himself all things, whether things on earth or things in heaven, by making peace through his blood, shed on the cross. 21 Once you were alienated from God and were enemies in your minds because of your evil behavior. 22 But now he has reconciled you

God the Son is Sovereign
God the Son reconciles those who were "enemies in your minds

The concept of so-called free will is covered by the phrase "in your minds."

I have many commentaries on Colossians and did not have to consult them. Colossians is quite clear. Nothing is "shoehorned." For some reason you keep missing what is in front of you.
 
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