Things to show an older generation of fundamentalists besides our liberty.

AmazedbyGrace said:
Your premise is rather insulting.

I did not leave my former IFBx church so I could get a tattoo, drink alcohol or dress differently. It was not about doing a bunch of stuff, it was because I realized I was taught bad doctrine and the leadership was generally abusive.

Priesthood of the believer was just given lip service. I was not supposed to read Scripture, pray and make decisions...no, the mannogawd was going to tell me where the fences in my life would be placed. No different opinions were tolerated. I remember a sermon where we were told we should never verbalize to ANYONE regarding a disagreement about something the pastor taught .

Abuse of the concept of "God's will". Funny, but it always seemed to be God's will for graduating seniors to attend the church's Bible college...just ask any staff member.

Financially abusing the congregation with constant pleas for lots and lots and lots of money. A stinking 20+ phase building program. Being told not to commit to an exact figure until after the banquet guest speaker gave his highly emotional sermon...and some people gave up their retirement money, vacation money, 2nd vehicles, and even wedding rings. Meanwhile the pastor made a huge salary, took amazing vacations, and owned vacation properties.

IMHO this pastor speaks out of both sides of his mouth. He is totally pragmatic and does what he needs to do to gain his objectives. Like telling us to dress more modestly during one conference because outside guests were coming. Or telling half-truths about the sabbatical money he received (from a very liberal organization - shhhhh). Saying he forbade his pervy brother from the pulpit after his divorce, yet allowed him previously to preach when he had to have known his brother had left a prior church for pervy behavior. Appearances, appearances, appearances.

Respecter of persons. The stories I could tell...

Abuse of pastoral authority. He wants it his way, and he wants it now. While being an active member was pretty exhausting (three to thrive! Soulwinning! Practices! Lesson Prep! Can you help with...), this pastor totally owned those poor overworked staff members. Everything, and I mean everything had to be top notch so that he could impress pastors like you so you will send people to his college. Which leads me to...

Cha-ching!!! The church is run like a business. When you allegedly advise new staff that they are expected to bring in 10 new tithing families in order to justify their salary, your thinking is off. The pastor justifies his high salary by saying a CEO of a company with this much staff would be earning....

Scare tactics. I recall when this pastor preached how you can not trust former members...and how our kids would go to the devil if we left. How there were no other God honoring churches in the entire area, so if we left we could no longer be fundamentalists....as if he owned the rights to the term fundamentalist.

So what can I show older generations of fundies?

The truth.

There are several other good churches in our area and beyond, even though they do not agree with the IFBx pastor in several areas. God loves them too and they are His children. There are also good schools to send our kids to (shock! God can use and guide our kids  outside the compound!). Our kids have NOT gone to the devil, even though they are no longer under the IFBx "umbrella of protection".  I can wear pants, have a tattoo (relax I don't have a tattoo), go to the movie house, etc. and still believe in the fundamentals of the faith.

My faith is to be in God, not in a church or a pastor or in a system of works and prohibitions. That is mostly what older fundies need to understand.

Wow AmazedbyGrace, did we go to the same church?  I am sure we did not but that goes to show that there are way to many "pastors" out there that fall in to the IFBx mold.

Well said AbG, well said.
 
pastorryanhayden said:
christundivided said:
Modern extreme fundamentalism is dead. I say good riddance. I don't owe them anything. I don't have a tattoo. I don't listen to "Taylor Swift", I'm not "knocking back" beers while singing "99 bottles of beer on the wall". The "parallels" you draw are silly. I'll praise my Master for the good things He's given me.

Keep on "heaping" your "back door" praise on someone else. This is a "fundamental" problem with most people who claim to be "fundamentalists". You don't really want "praise" or "thankfulness" to go where it belongs. You all want it yourselves. I've never been more sick of "pastor" appreciation dinners, parties, meetings and the like. Seems like every time I turn around I know someone that's going to another one.....somewhere for someone. I'm sure Jesus might be just a little jealous. After all.....I have read that He is a jealous God.

Where was the "back door praise" in that article?  I'm not for praising men.  I'm trying to start a movement among independent Baptists to take a stand against preacher worship.  I was by no means trying to say that we should be heaping praise on the pastors from our past.

What I was saying was that we should be patient with them and grateful for them.  Gratitude is not the same thing as praise or worship. 

Maybe you had a IFBx pastor who was a gospel destroying, Bible replacing, narcissistic dictator.  I know some existed.  I also know that the vast majority of those who are whining about fundamentalism probably weren't pastored by those men, but by humble (if not confused) pastors who were just trying to do the right thing by God and their church.  I have a feeling their are a lot of thirty-five year old evangelicals who still haven't gotten over their parents forbidding them to see Rambo or their Christian school making them wear a tie everyday. 

Grow up.  Love Jesus.  Love His Word.  Give the grace you are expecting.  That's all I'm saying.
Um...I missed this bizarre example. This vanity is just the tip of the ice-burg, hence the 35 yr old who is still sore ^^

It's school, where children play and learn. Ties don't belong in school. Let children be children.

 
I wasn't advocating for either example.  Just saying these are the kind of trivial things some people whine about.
 
pastorryanhayden said:
Bob H said:
pastorryanhayden said:
I wrote this piece on my blog.  (I haven't been blogging much lately, mostly because I'm busy with pastoring and trying to get my pizza oven finished.)  It is about how my generation (I'm 29 BTW) uses Christian liberty as an excuse to run to the other extreme of the IFBx crowd. 

http://www.ryan-hayden.com/to-all-those-struggling-with-the-generation-before/

Any thoughts?


I wouldn't worry to much about "us older" generation fundy's. New evangelicalism is alive and well in America so be happy


:)

Huh?  I'm not following you.  Are you considering me a new evangelical?

If you were an evangelical...the term new evangelical was a shot at anyone who didn't believe like Bob Jones in the 70's and is archaic....you wouldn't have pastor in your screen name.  :)
 
I'm actually pretty familiar with the history of the evangelical/fundamentalist split and I agree.  New-evangelicalism went the way of traditional liberalism a long time ago. 
 
One of the things we can learn from church history is that though the terms/names may change the battles are still the same. Nobody's gone anywhere.




 
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