Pastors....Serving Tables.....

[The Rogue Tomato]

While I am certain that many pastors would agree with this...... I think the apostles made a horrible mistake. Just because you read something in the Scriptures that someone did....... doesn't mean that God approves of what they did.

So you mean when we read about something someone in the Bible did, that doesn't necessarily make it a prescribed model to imitate? 

Dang, there goes my argument for having sex with a prostitute because the Bible records people having sex with prostitutes (or in the case of Judah, who thought Tamar was a prostitute). 

 

[Mathew Ward]

While I am certain that many pastors would agree with this...... I think the apostles made a horrible mistake. Just because you read something in the Scriptures that someone did....... doesn't mean that God approves of what they did. This includes the apostles. The apostles made many mistakes. Now, I am not condemning the apostles. However, if we do not want to make the same mistakes.....we should learn from their mistakes

If the Apostles not serving tables was a mistake then why is this the result?

Acts 6:7 And the word of God increased; and the number of the disciples multiplied in Jerusalem greatly; and a great company of the priests were obedient to the faith.

 

[AresMan]

Act 6:6  Whom they set before the apostles: and when they had prayed, they laid their hands on them.
Act 6:7  And the word of God increased; and the number of the disciples multiplied in Jerusalem greatly; and a great company of the priests were obedient to the faith.

It sounds like the apostles did the right thing.  8)

 

[christundivided]

While I am certain that many pastors would agree with this...... I think the apostles made a horrible mistake. Just because you read something in the Scriptures that someone did....... doesn't mean that God approves of what they did. This includes the apostles. The apostles made many mistakes. Now, I am not condemning the apostles. However, if we do not want to make the same mistakes.....we should learn from their mistakes

If the Apostles not serving tables was a mistake then why is this the result?

Acts 6:7 And the word of God increased; and the number of the disciples multiplied in Jerusalem greatly; and a great company of the priests were obedient to the faith.

Good question. You and Aresman seem to be on the same page. Great minds think the same???

There are several answers to this question that really end up flowing to the same conclusion.

First, Its important to realize that God often blesses us regardless of our own actions. If He didn't, then we would be in a word of hurt.

Rogue mentioned the story of Tamar. Even though Judah fathered a children with the wife of his own son, God blessed Judah. Judah and Tamar's relationship produces Perez. which is counted in the earthly bloodline of Jesus Christ our Lord. God often works regardless of our own actions.

In this specific instance, we must recognize the innate and intrinsic qualities of the Gospel. Paul wrote to the Romans and declared the Gospel had the power, in and of itself, to bring salvation to mankind. This is the reason people can make mistakes. Horrible mistakes and God still blesses the preaching of the Gospel.  There are many mega churches across this country that teach damnable lies, half truths and conjecture. Yet, these same church see people saved by the Gospel. Its a mistake to believe that God blesses the mega churches because they make right decision or preach an untainted Gospel. This is one of the reasons that Paul could rejoice even when his enemies preached about Christ. Even though his enemies, the very enemies of the Gospel, were causing trouble.... the innate power of preaching Christ can overcome the wicked heart of man.

Paul also spoke of how those in Christ can always do better. He told Timothy in

2Ti 2:20  But in a great house there are not only vessels of gold and of silver, but also of wood and of earth; and some to honour, and some to dishonour.

Did you notice the words "In any great house.". I can't help but believe that Paul had himself in mind was he wrote these words. He even once spoke of how he had to endlessly bring his own body under subjection..... lest he... himself... become a "cast away". He spoke of "pressing toward the mark", laying aside all the weights, and of wood, hay, and stubble.

At our very best, we aren't perfect. The same goes for the apostles. Again. I'm not casting a stone. I am simply recognizing the truth. A truth that we need to know.

 

[Mathew Ward]

While I am certain that many pastors would agree with this...... I think the apostles made a horrible mistake. Just because you read something in the Scriptures that someone did....... doesn't mean that God approves of what they did. This includes the apostles. The apostles made many mistakes. Now, I am not condemning the apostles. However, if we do not want to make the same mistakes.....we should learn from their mistakes

If the Apostles not serving tables was a mistake then why is this the result?

Acts 6:7 And the word of God increased; and the number of the disciples multiplied in Jerusalem greatly; and a great company of the priests were obedient to the faith.

Good question. You and Aresman seem to be on the same page. Great minds think the same???

There are several answers to this question that really end up flowing to the same conclusion.

First, Its important to realize that God often blesses us regardless of our own actions. If He didn't, then we would be in a word of hurt.

Rogue mentioned the story of Tamar. Even though Judah fathered a children with the wife of his own son, God blessed Judah. Judah and Tamar relationship produces Perez which is counted in the earthly bloodline of Jesus Christ our Lord. God often works regardless of our own actions.

In this specific instance, we must recognize the innate and intrinsic qualities of the Gospel. Paul wrote to the Romans and declared the Gospel had the power, in and of itself, to bring salvation to mankind. This is the reason people can make mistakes. Horrible mistakes and God still blesses the preaching of the Gospel.  There are many mega churches across this country that teach damnable lies, half truths and conjecture. Yet, these same church see people saved by the Gospel. Its a mistake believe that blesses the mega churches because they make right decision or preach an untainted Gospel. This is one of the reasons that Paul could rejoice even when his enemies preached about Christ. Even though his enemies, the very enemies of the Gospel were causing trouble.... the innate power of preaching Christ can overcome the wicked heart of man.

Paul also spoke of how those in Christ can always do better. He told Timothy in

2Ti 2:20  But in a great house there are not only vessels of gold and of silver, but also of wood and of earth; and some to honour, and some to dishonour.

Did you notice the words "In any great house.". I can't help but believe that Paul had himself in mind was he wrote these words. He even once spoke of how he had to endlessly bring his own body under subjection..... lest he... himself... become a "cast away". He spoke of "pressing toward the mark", laying aside all the weights, and of wood, hay, and stubble.

At our very best, we aren't perfect. The same goes for the apostles. Again. I'm not casting a stone. I am simply recognizing the truth. A truth that we need to know.

Thank God that he blesses in spite of us.

The other thought that I had was, was this portion in Acts for pastors or did it only apply to the apostles?

 

[christundivided]

While I am certain that many pastors would agree with this...... I think the apostles made a horrible mistake. Just because you read something in the Scriptures that someone did....... doesn't mean that God approves of what they did. This includes the apostles. The apostles made many mistakes. Now, I am not condemning the apostles. However, if we do not want to make the same mistakes.....we should learn from their mistakes

If the Apostles not serving tables was a mistake then why is this the result?

Acts 6:7 And the word of God increased; and the number of the disciples multiplied in Jerusalem greatly; and a great company of the priests were obedient to the faith.

Good question. You and Aresman seem to be on the same page. Great minds think the same???

There are several answers to this question that really end up flowing to the same conclusion.

First, Its important to realize that God often blesses us regardless of our own actions. If He didn't, then we would be in a word of hurt.

Rogue mentioned the story of Tamar. Even though Judah fathered a children with the wife of his own son, God blessed Judah. Judah and Tamar relationship produces Perez which is counted in the earthly bloodline of Jesus Christ our Lord. God often works regardless of our own actions.

In this specific instance, we must recognize the innate and intrinsic qualities of the Gospel. Paul wrote to the Romans and declared the Gospel had the power, in and of itself, to bring salvation to mankind. This is the reason people can make mistakes. Horrible mistakes and God still blesses the preaching of the Gospel.  There are many mega churches across this country that teach damnable lies, half truths and conjecture. Yet, these same church see people saved by the Gospel. Its a mistake believe that blesses the mega churches because they make right decision or preach an untainted Gospel. This is one of the reasons that Paul could rejoice even when his enemies preached about Christ. Even though his enemies, the very enemies of the Gospel were causing trouble.... the innate power of preaching Christ can overcome the wicked heart of man.

Paul also spoke of how those in Christ can always do better. He told Timothy in

2Ti 2:20  But in a great house there are not only vessels of gold and of silver, but also of wood and of earth; and some to honour, and some to dishonour.

Did you notice the words "In any great house.". I can't help but believe that Paul had himself in mind was he wrote these words. He even once spoke of how he had to endlessly bring his own body under subjection..... lest he... himself... become a "cast away". He spoke of "pressing toward the mark", laying aside all the weights, and of wood, hay, and stubble.

At our very best, we aren't perfect. The same goes for the apostles. Again. I'm not casting a stone. I am simply recognizing the truth. A truth that we need to know.

Thank God that he blesses in spite of us.

The other thought that I had was, was this portion in Acts for pastors or did it only apply to the apostles?

I'd say it applies to any "servant" that has the appointed authority to dictate the actions of his fellow-servant.

 

[subllibrm]

I am trying to imagine CU finding someone he can have fellowship with since no one seems to agree with him on much of anything.  :-\

 

[christundivided]

I am trying to imagine CU finding someone he can have fellowship with since no one seems to agree with him on much of anything.  :-\

That is true to some degree. I have respect for several around here.... even though we disagree. FSSL is an honest man full of integrity. The same with T-Bone. I even respect Ransom.... even though we don't usually get along.

Contrary to popular belief, I actually do have friends that have no problem sharing exactly what I share here....

 

[subllibrm]

I am trying to imagine CU finding someone he can have fellowship with since no one seems to agree with him on much of anything.  :-\

That is true to some degree. I have respect for several around here.... even though we disagree. FSSL is an honest man full of integrity. The same with T-Bone. I even respect Ransom.... even though we don't usually get along.

Contrary to popular belief, I actually do have friends that have no problem sharing exactly what I share here....

Just yanking on ya!

I have no doubt that you and I could burn up quite few logs in the campfire while discussing things of the Lord. 

 

[The Rogue Tomato]

I am trying to imagine CU finding someone he can have fellowship with since no one seems to agree with him on much of anything.  :-\

I think I'd get along with CU just fine.  We don't agree on everything, but who does?

 

[subllibrm]

I am trying to imagine CU finding someone he can have fellowship with since no one seems to agree with him on much of anything.  :-\

I think I'd get along with CU just fine.  We don't agree on everything, but who does?

Then you are invited to the campfire too! 

 

[BandGuy]

Lets review how our Lord washed the feet of His disciples.

Joh 13:13  Ye call me Master and Lord: and ye say well; for so I am.
Joh 13:14  If I then, your Lord and Master, have washed your feet; ye also ought to wash one another's feet.
Joh 13:15  For I have given you an example, that ye should do as I have done to you.
Joh 13:16  Verily, verily, I say unto you, The servant is not greater than his lord; neither he that is sent greater than he that sent him.
Joh 13:17  If ye know these things, happy are ye if ye do them.

v. 13:  Should the congregation start referring to the Apostles as "Master" and "Lord"?

You seem to have two presuppositions which I am not sure are correct:
1.  Devoting themselves to the study of the Word and to preaching is not a form of service.
2.  The apostles were saying that they were above ever waiting tables.  I think what we have here is an example of men keeping their focus on the main part of what God called them to do and not allowing themselves to be too preoccupied with other stuff to fulfill this ministry.

 

[Tarheel Baptist]

I had CU on ignore for awhile but decided that was hypocritical on a 'fighting forum'.
I actually find myself in agreement with him....once in awhile! 

I'm sure many here might feel the same way about me....I'm too fundy for the contemporary 'camp' and too liberal for the fundy crowd.

 

[BandGuy]

I don't know why, and maybe I am misinterpreting the spirit of some in this thread, but this portion of Scripture which was part of our daily Bible reading yesterday came to my mind as I was reading this thread:

10 A rebuke goes deeper into a man of understanding
than a hundred blows into a fool.
11 An evil man seeks only rebellion,
and a cruel messenger will be sent against him.
12 Let a man meet a she- bear robbed of her cubs
rather than a fool in his folly.
13 If anyone returns evil for good,
evil will not depart from his house.
14 The beginning of strife is like letting out water,
so quit before the quarrel breaks out.
15 He who justifies the wicked and he who condemns the righteous
are both alike an abomination to the Lord.
16 Why should a fool have money in his hand to buy wisdom
when he has no sense?...
27 Whoever restrains his words has knowledge,
and he who has a cool spirit is a man of understanding.
28 Even a fool who keeps silent is considered wise;
when he closes his lips, he is deemed intelligent.

Proverbs 17

 

[christundivided]

I don't know why, and maybe I am misinterpreting the spirit of some in this thread, but this portion of Scripture which was part of our daily Bible reading yesterday came to my mind as I was reading this thread:

10 A rebuke goes deeper into a man of understanding
than a hundred blows into a fool.
11 An evil man seeks only rebellion,
and a cruel messenger will be sent against him.
12 Let a man meet a she- bear robbed of her cubs
rather than a fool in his folly.
13 If anyone returns evil for good,
evil will not depart from his house.
14 The beginning of strife is like letting out water,
so quit before the quarrel breaks out.
15 He who justifies the wicked and he who condemns the righteous
are both alike an abomination to the Lord.
16 Why should a fool have money in his hand to buy wisdom
when he has no sense?...
27 Whoever restrains his words has knowledge,
and he who has a cool spirit is a man of understanding.
28 Even a fool who keeps silent is considered wise;
when he closes his lips, he is deemed intelligent.

Proverbs 17

.... Man that hurt....

at least I know not to expect a stream of urine to come from you if I somehow catch on fire....  8)

 

[BandGuy]

I don't know why, and maybe I am misinterpreting the spirit of some in this thread, but this portion of Scripture which was part of our daily Bible reading yesterday came to my mind as I was reading this thread:

10 A rebuke goes deeper into a man of understanding
than a hundred blows into a fool.
11 An evil man seeks only rebellion,
and a cruel messenger will be sent against him.
12 Let a man meet a she- bear robbed of her cubs
rather than a fool in his folly.
13 If anyone returns evil for good,
evil will not depart from his house.
14 The beginning of strife is like letting out water,
so quit before the quarrel breaks out.
15 He who justifies the wicked and he who condemns the righteous
are both alike an abomination to the Lord.
16 Why should a fool have money in his hand to buy wisdom
when he has no sense?...
27 Whoever restrains his words has knowledge,
and he who has a cool spirit is a man of understanding.
28 Even a fool who keeps silent is considered wise;
when he closes his lips, he is deemed intelligent.

Proverbs 17

.... Man that hurt....

at least I know not to expect a stream of urine to come from you if I somehow catch on fire....  8)

I would most certainly do everything within my power to put out the fire and save your life if it ever came to that.