RAIDER said:
unless it is a thread started by Raider, and then as we know, post away. It's all about the numbers!
unless it is a thread started by Raider, and then as we know, post away. It's all about the numbers!
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I believe them that sin should be rebuked before all that others may fear ...
But I also believe that one should be careful that an accusation is not received against an elder except before 2 or 3 witnesses.
There is a lot out of balance in our society today, and this is one of those issues. Wickedness in the pulpit such as that by the Hyleses, Combs, and now Schaap is too often used as an excuse to oppose good men used of God preaching against that kind of sin. And be it a discovered briefcase with damning evidence, the bravery of a young lady sending a letter to her "pastor" revealing her disgust at his shenanigans in tearing up her parents' home, the failed suicidal cry for help from a victim of terrible abuse, or some discovered texts on a phone, God has a way of uncovering sin, doesn't He? It becomes a problem only when you exclude from the equation God and His ability to judge and execute justice, and begin conducting your own inquisition. There you come to expect that since some did these terrible things which were uncovered, all must be guilty. That is the kind of thing that SFL does. It is the other extreme, and out of balance. The sin comes from excluding God as a reality in leadership and service, the rebellion comes from excluding God from uncovering and judging sin in this present world. In both extremes faith is damaged.
But I also believe that one should be careful that an accusation is not received against an elder except before 2 or 3 witnesses.
There is a lot out of balance in our society today, and this is one of those issues. Wickedness in the pulpit such as that by the Hyleses, Combs, and now Schaap is too often used as an excuse to oppose good men used of God preaching against that kind of sin. And be it a discovered briefcase with damning evidence, the bravery of a young lady sending a letter to her "pastor" revealing her disgust at his shenanigans in tearing up her parents' home, the failed suicidal cry for help from a victim of terrible abuse, or some discovered texts on a phone, God has a way of uncovering sin, doesn't He? It becomes a problem only when you exclude from the equation God and His ability to judge and execute justice, and begin conducting your own inquisition. There you come to expect that since some did these terrible things which were uncovered, all must be guilty. That is the kind of thing that SFL does. It is the other extreme, and out of balance. The sin comes from excluding God as a reality in leadership and service, the rebellion comes from excluding God from uncovering and judging sin in this present world. In both extremes faith is damaged.
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If the NT did not give us instructions for dealing with this, then I would agree, PB. In Rev. 2&3, God tells 7 churches to fix their problems, or He will get involved. And His solution is the worst case scenario.
You dont know how many of us were blackballed for speaking against the heresy and perversion of our pastor (Schaap). You have no idea how the arrogant the teachings he was allowed to continue spewing out in pride, year after year, have affected hundreds of churches that were fellow travellers with Hammond. How far the music penetrated, how far the doubt cast on the Word of God reached, how far the arrogant godboy ranting pastor mentality found hold...all because many people were waiting for God to do what he told us to do.
Cowardice is not godliness. Apathy is not patience.
Do you pray for God to save sinners, or do you preach the Gospel to sinners? The briefcase would've been lighter, if JH would've listened to the witnesses.
I watched your generation sleep at the wheel. I decide not to. I spoke up. I lost what some may hold dear for it. I was proved right, and my generation is revisiting their beliefs, now. You want to send them to the Enemy? Tell them that they should wait til God acts, to impeach an elder. They will write off all things Baptist, believing that word to be the problem. Tell them that it is on all of us to be vigilant, and liberty does not coexist with security, and that everyone of us must give account of himself unto God, and men will want in.
Anishinabe
You dont know how many of us were blackballed for speaking against the heresy and perversion of our pastor (Schaap). You have no idea how the arrogant the teachings he was allowed to continue spewing out in pride, year after year, have affected hundreds of churches that were fellow travellers with Hammond. How far the music penetrated, how far the doubt cast on the Word of God reached, how far the arrogant godboy ranting pastor mentality found hold...all because many people were waiting for God to do what he told us to do.
Cowardice is not godliness. Apathy is not patience.
Do you pray for God to save sinners, or do you preach the Gospel to sinners? The briefcase would've been lighter, if JH would've listened to the witnesses.
I watched your generation sleep at the wheel. I decide not to. I spoke up. I lost what some may hold dear for it. I was proved right, and my generation is revisiting their beliefs, now. You want to send them to the Enemy? Tell them that they should wait til God acts, to impeach an elder. They will write off all things Baptist, believing that word to be the problem. Tell them that it is on all of us to be vigilant, and liberty does not coexist with security, and that everyone of us must give account of himself unto God, and men will want in.
Anishinabe
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My father moved us to Hammond in '78. I enrolled in HAC in '93. Got hired on Church Staff in '01, after serving as a youth pastor for 3 years in Gary. Planted 'Chapels' for 6 years, and taught Missions Students to 'plant a NT church' at the same time. All missions students were required to do their junior/senior years in Chapels. Never graduated. In credits, I have a semester to go. "I already hired you, what do you need a degree for?" Is a direct quote from the Pastor. And by the time I left Hammond, I no longer wanted a degree signed by the Chancellor and his clown posse.PappaBear said:
No, I haven't sought an 'online degree', or any other piece of paper. I like the stigma I wear now. Outside the camp, with Jesus. Anyway, it's too much talking about me, already, I'm getting nauseous.
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You might look above to my reply #24 where I specifically referenced the NT instructions for "dealing with this" in 1Tim 5:19,20. Btw... what is the "this" you believe I am dealing with? Those instructions in the scriptures ARE balanced, and that is what I advocate.prophet said:
Your summation of Rev 2&3 is quaint. There are 2 churches there which Christ has nothing against them. Yes, there are threats to remove one's candlestick out of place or to fight against another with the sword of His mouth, but that is my point. He is LORD of the churches, and very capable of keeping them in line. Significantly, in those letters to the 7 churches, it is not exclusively involving the pastor as the problem, which appears to be what you want to do. And no church is urged to impeach its leadership. My view is that the stars represent the pastors of the churches and they are said to be held in Christ's hands.
I don't? What makes you think I do not know some of these things? You are a Johnny-come-lately to this situation. JS inherited the system from his FIL Jack Hyles, who was his mentor and taught him those things. BTW.... just what do you believe God told you to do that you did not do?prophet said:
I want to point something out to you that is too obvious and should be chilling. JS is in jail. You know why? It isn't for arrogant teaching or preaching. It is not for spewing out pride or negatively impacting sister churches. It is certainly not for his casting doubt on the word of God, something done on these forums by our brothers and sisters daily (reference bgwilkinson). He is not even in jail for blackballing people or playing political games while in the Captain's chair at those ministries. He is in jail for moral failure and the commission of federal crimes. And if he had not been caught ... he would still be at FBC spewing, ranting, casting doubt, and blackballing, all to the loud Amen's and approval of the FBCH majority crowd.
He is not in jail because of anything you, or SFL, or any group like you did. Dave Hyles should have been sent to jail, but he never made it. The Combses were sent to prison, but again FBCH and you had not one thing to do with that outcome, it was "of the LORD." God knows how to take care of His people, but it is chilling how you phrased that "all because many people were waiting for God to do..." Has your faith been so damaged that you have lost faith in the LORD to act in the appropriate time? Beware bitterness and grasping the axe of vengeance so quickly, my friend. It only gets you into trouble.
And rebellion is not godliness, either and temperance (restraining yourself) is still a fruit of the Spirit and approved of in the scripture. It seems to me that something I have said somewhere has given you a false impression that I somehow believe in cowardice and apathy, because you have made these challenging posts to me more than once. I do not. But I certainly do not condone taking affairs into your own hands and exchanging one evil dictator for the dictates of another. The mistake of riding a pendulum to the opposite extreme is too often made by people who have had their eyes opened and find out they have been misled.prophet said:
Both! That is what I am trying to indicate. It is not an either/or situation where you can only do one or the other. Balance does both. What do you do? Only soul-winning without any desire of the Spirit like most who practice easy-prayerism? or only prayer like the sorry Calvinist pirates who don't do anything?prophet said:
And JS would have never sent that many immoral texts if your generation had only listened to the witnesses like Voyle Glover, George Godfrey, and Vic Nischik. But you didn't listen, and many here still today gripe and complain about them, yet THEY SOUNDED THE ALARM that went unheeded. Which is why people should still be very wary of what is going on in Hammond, because the system that allowed it all to happen is still in place, and the sheep are still bahhhhhing their amens. Everybody just wants it to go away.prophet said:
I watched your generation ignore the testimonies I knew from experience to be true. I watched your generation mail dung in response to honest efforts to warn you with facts. I watched your crowd close their eyes and drink the kool-aid. You act a bit too self-righteous. You seem to forget that my generation is the generation of Godfrey, Stan Harris, Mark Rasmussen, Jerry Scott and Toby Weaver. Asleep at the wheel?! Oh, please!!prophet said:
*SIGH* ... *GROAN* ...prophet said:
I hate to break this to you, but you are not the first. I attended, but did not graduate. But I did not just walk away when I left. Rather than waiting until I was out and then only fussing about spilt milk on an internet site afterwards, I put my complaints concerning their unbiblical controlling methods in writing and sent it to the administration. That landed me in "the office" staring at a door a few feet away which 6 or 7 years later would be denied it existed. There were other issues, legitimate ones (I was no choir boy). But they were not concerned about them at all. What had Dr. Hyles all worked up and yelling at me was the "concentration camp" letter. After storming about it loudly, he threatened to see to it "personally" that I would never preach in a Fundamental Baptist Church ever again. You lost what some may hold dear? Man, I lost so much, it would take a book to write about it all -- about 5 years of the ideal learning stage in my life, friends, what little money which had been inherited from my father's death, and a lot of self respect. I suffered wounds that after 30 years have still not fully healed! And you speak of what you have lost in this recent debacle? Look on these internet boards, the HAC rooms are normally the most active with very bitter and angry posts because of the generous amounts of flotsam that HAC/FBCH has left in its wake.
I cannot speak for all of my generation, but I know I have had to do a lot of self-examination and revisit many of my beliefs. I wanted to make sure I separated out what I got at HAC from what was rightly there from the genuine pastors the LORD placed in my life. I must admit there were a few times I very nearly did abandon faith, church, the whole thing -- all I can really say is that God wouldn't let me go. In the process, I have seen the LORD's hand holding me up instead of my own legs and have discovered that the just shall live by his faith, that God can be trusted, and the Bible and its promises are true. God is true, and every man -- no exceptions, there -- is a liar.
Apparently you missed my routine "Flee" posts on the older FFF's. I would regularly post an admonition for prospective students to flee HAC and FBCH. Not for reasons such as KJVO (I are one, after all!) or standards and the rules, but mostly because of their idolatrous practices of elevating men to pedestals of worship. But those posts were often ignored and many times only earned me more scorn from such as Braemer and TRB, who would often agree with my other posts, normally. Now after all these years you come storming in claiming all my generation were quiet cowards who were sleeping at the wheel? You appear to have learned Schaap's arrogance too well.
I went to school with Jack Patterson, and grew to admire him "back then." But rather than this same righteous indignation you currently show, you are disposed in that matter to speak in defense of the man despite the amount of public evidence supporting the allegations made against him. I hope you are right about him, but I would caution you, men are flesh and flesh is weak and should never be trusted.
Only if there is no God Who can preserve His own. Otherwise, only the dogs will return to their own vomit. As I said earlier, there are a lot of bitter people out there, but HAC has attracted a clientele based on performance rather than gospel truth, and it should be understood that many are lost. It is another one of those iconoclastic tales that needs to be shattered because association with HAC/FBCH does not necessitate people are genuinely converted. God can be relied on to keep His own sheep, I have no doubt about that.prophet said:
True. But beware the danger of seeing vigilance turn to vigilanteism. The problem does not lie in the eldership only, that is Jeri Massi's view. Rather, it is improper discipline in churches, or absent discipline for wickedness altogether. And that is why there is still great danger. Bro. Wilkerson, in his Q&A, mentioned church discipline. But note that he was vetted and presented to the congregation by the existing leadership. There has been a lot of internet discussion about whether this one or that one is leaving because they have been fired or whatever with many saying they do not know what is going on behind the scenes. We are called to be children of light and not to walk in darkness and secrets. The same crowd that enabled both Jacks and many others are still there and still in power and there has not been a single public discipline or rebuke that I am aware of. For all your harsh protestations and new found righteous indignation, the system is still there.prophet said:
Back when JS first came to power, the HAC forum at the old site was filled with hope when the alumni and associated posters voiced that yes, Jack Hyles had been wrong on some things, but JS was a breath of fresh air and was making needed changes. He had to go slow in some areas, and it would do too much damage to do some things openly. Now, after his fall, history repeats itself on this forum as many rise up and say, "I was right about him!" But the system that enabled him was never dismantled and the sycophants that surrounded both Jacks and Dave have never been openly purged. It very well could be that in another decade or so, we will be right back here going through this same thing, again. Only then, some other fresh face will be crying out against you for having been asleep at the wheel this whole time and your cowardice. Why? Don't they know that you have made your stand and it has cost you so much? No, because until the actual sin is proven and everything has blown up, they have just ignored you and treated you like a leper, your prophecies long forgotten after they have now come true.
For now, hold on to faith in God. None of those calling for inquisitions and attempting to grab power and control have ever succeeded at impeaching these erring elders. In fact, they are normally former followers who are ashamed at their own delusion. In every case, it HAS BEEN God which exposed them. What we need is people with the fortitude to openly rebuke before all when God does that, and follow the LORD instead of leading a charge or acting in vengeance that is not ours to have. Find the scriptural balance.
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If your generation, who were in charge/senior staff when we pointed out to them that JS was in error, would have listened, in the early 2000's, then he wouldn't have made it to the crime. You can't see this?
If the IFB that interact with Hammond weren't led astray by the error of Hyles, to blindly follow the pastor and hear no accusation, then they might have ostricized JS long before he could do all the damage he did.
Why are you so defensive?
I never heard the name Voyle Glover, til 2010. Vic Nischick I saw walking arm in arm with JH, til he left. (I was gone for 4 years, and really heard nothing from 1989-1993 of what was going on)
And I was in High School , so what would I know? All I knew of DH was what was written on a bridge on rt. 30.
When my turn came, I spoke up.
I don't know where your attitude comes from, but you are yapping at the wrong guy. I don't care what your whining, gutless, dictatorial, self-serving, self agrandizing, Protestantized GENERATION thinks, says or does.
Your response is perfect. Somehow it was right to leave the pervert in place, until God had to step in.
Know ye not that ye shall judge angels?
Serious question. Why didn't God step in and remove JH? Since you think He is the only one who should remove a pastor.
What about admonishing a heretick twice, then booting him? Doesn't apply to pastor?
You don't think the churches in Rev. 2-3 had to remove an elder to flush out the problem?
No wonder we had to start over, learn everything on our own. All we were taught is what not to do, by you.
Anishinaabe
If the IFB that interact with Hammond weren't led astray by the error of Hyles, to blindly follow the pastor and hear no accusation, then they might have ostricized JS long before he could do all the damage he did.
Why are you so defensive?
I never heard the name Voyle Glover, til 2010. Vic Nischick I saw walking arm in arm with JH, til he left. (I was gone for 4 years, and really heard nothing from 1989-1993 of what was going on)
And I was in High School , so what would I know? All I knew of DH was what was written on a bridge on rt. 30.
When my turn came, I spoke up.
I don't know where your attitude comes from, but you are yapping at the wrong guy. I don't care what your whining, gutless, dictatorial, self-serving, self agrandizing, Protestantized GENERATION thinks, says or does.
Your response is perfect. Somehow it was right to leave the pervert in place, until God had to step in.
Know ye not that ye shall judge angels?
Serious question. Why didn't God step in and remove JH? Since you think He is the only one who should remove a pastor.
What about admonishing a heretick twice, then booting him? Doesn't apply to pastor?
You don't think the churches in Rev. 2-3 had to remove an elder to flush out the problem?
No wonder we had to start over, learn everything on our own. All we were taught is what not to do, by you.
Anishinaabe
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IMO, until FBC as a whole, renounces the leadership style of JH, they are doomed to repeat what happen with JS, when it comes to doctrine.
When it came out about his view on Then Lords Table, I questioned a 100% Hyles person on it and his response was, "if you only knew JS walk with God". At that point I just said o.k.
My point is that JH set this blind loyalty in motion. In the Hyles Movement of the IFB. He was Pastor for 40 years and this is how his flock responded, there is no denying this.
His church he was pastor of not only, but those that followed as well. smh. Very sad.
When it came out about his view on Then Lords Table, I questioned a 100% Hyles person on it and his response was, "if you only knew JS walk with God". At that point I just said o.k.
My point is that JH set this blind loyalty in motion. In the Hyles Movement of the IFB. He was Pastor for 40 years and this is how his flock responded, there is no denying this.
His church he was pastor of not only, but those that followed as well. smh. Very sad.
Bruh said:IMO, until FBC as a whole, renounces the leadership style of JH, they are doomed to repeat what happen with JS, when it comes to doctrine.
When it came out about his view on Then Lords Table, I questioned a 100% Hyles person on it and his response was, "if you only knew JS walk with God". At that point I just said o.k.
My point is that JH set this blind loyalty in motion. In the Hyles Movement of the IFB. He was Pastor for 40 years and this is how his flock responded, there is no denying this.
His church he was pastor of not only, but those that followed as well. smh. Very sad.
I agree 100% bruhaha. JH was a gifted and very persuasive speaker and a lot of folks fell for it. I often listen to a lot of his protege's like Jack Trieber, Gray, Domelle, etc. and read what they write and they all have taken the bait hook-line-and-sinker. I was raised in a little spot in the road up North and didn't know much about fundamentalism or what was going on around the country and I thought jh knew. I was mistaken.
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aleshanee said:
The only thing that should be CONSIDERED when a 50 something year old man is having sex with a 16 year old girl is his jail sentence.
Why in the world would anyone say "yeah but the girl"? She is 16, so what if she has a past, he is 50 something years old. And has been married for at least 30 years. Now you tell me who has more experience. JS took advantage of this young lady.
Shame on anyone who says "yeah but the girl".
prophet said:
Prophet, if Pappabear sent a letter to the administration detailing the controlling methods of JH and he was "punished" for writing the letter, how can he be considered a part of the problem? He was one of many who confronted the evil and were denigrated by the authority. There are many victims who have been affected by the sins of this pastor, but my heart especially grieves for the youthful victim who had no reason to believe the adults in her life could be so corrupt. If the manipulation and betrayal causes an adult to be bitter, how much worse the damage to a young girl.
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aleshanee said:
Well, I'm not trying to throw stones at anybody. The thing that upsets me, is anyone that tries to point the finger at this girl. And I'm not this way because it is JS, it could be anyone.
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I don't know PB, nor was I personally calling him out, but rather his generation. But his response was ridiculous, and also par for the course. I am trying to help keep my generation from leaving the B, because of the IFB.JrChurch said:
Telling the 40 and younger generation that they should leave the church discipline of pervert elders to God, will chase them strait into Satan's trap he has set, through the channels of E.C., Char., Calvinist and etc. into the arms of Momma Whore Rome. 'Where was God when (fill in the blanks) happened?', they'll ask. He was watching us ignore His instructions about dealing with hereticks and perverts.
Anishinaabe
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Pappa Bear,
I don't know you, and I never heard a word one of those men said, that you named, like Stan Harris, who is a dear friend of my father, and Mark Rasmussen who taught me in S.S. until he left, in the middle of the year. I never have heard why he left. I learned something was wrong by comparing the AV to what I was seeing, or rather God showed me, as He does all His sheep.
I'm not sure why you think It's ok for you to mail a letter, but no one else to act.
And you don't know how I left, so don't pretend that you do. I told my fellow staff members, the college students I taught, the people I pastored that JS was a Satanic plant. I was told to be loyal or pack my bags, by my peeers.
I confronted JS several times, and I believe he disliked me greatly, or at least he was offended by my challenges.
I wasn't a college student who left, I was a staff member in the church I grew up in, who left. And I left after years of trying to affect change from within.
Ask anyone who knows me. My name is Michael Ramsey, I'm a missionary now, I have no regrets for my own actions, and the little I 'lost', was for Christ's sake. I was attempting humor, when I said I lost anything, I have lost nothing.
I believe that JH violated Eph 5, instructions for wives to be submitted to their own husbands in the context of the church, and not to be some other man's secretary. I believe he stole Jen. Nisch's loyalty away from her husband. I taught those who I led to avoid this error.
Lastly, I don't remember reading one post by you on the old fff. I have nothing against you, and I'm glad you took the stand that you did. So, I really mean this, I don't know why you are against confronting a pastor who is in sin.
Anishinaabe
I don't know you, and I never heard a word one of those men said, that you named, like Stan Harris, who is a dear friend of my father, and Mark Rasmussen who taught me in S.S. until he left, in the middle of the year. I never have heard why he left. I learned something was wrong by comparing the AV to what I was seeing, or rather God showed me, as He does all His sheep.
I'm not sure why you think It's ok for you to mail a letter, but no one else to act.
And you don't know how I left, so don't pretend that you do. I told my fellow staff members, the college students I taught, the people I pastored that JS was a Satanic plant. I was told to be loyal or pack my bags, by my peeers.
I confronted JS several times, and I believe he disliked me greatly, or at least he was offended by my challenges.
I wasn't a college student who left, I was a staff member in the church I grew up in, who left. And I left after years of trying to affect change from within.
Ask anyone who knows me. My name is Michael Ramsey, I'm a missionary now, I have no regrets for my own actions, and the little I 'lost', was for Christ's sake. I was attempting humor, when I said I lost anything, I have lost nothing.
I believe that JH violated Eph 5, instructions for wives to be submitted to their own husbands in the context of the church, and not to be some other man's secretary. I believe he stole Jen. Nisch's loyalty away from her husband. I taught those who I led to avoid this error.
Lastly, I don't remember reading one post by you on the old fff. I have nothing against you, and I'm glad you took the stand that you did. So, I really mean this, I don't know why you are against confronting a pastor who is in sin.
Anishinaabe
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Prophet, you are shifting blame in the wrong direction. You are trying to throw it back into the past, ignoring that your current struggle is only a REPEAT of history, and having the exact same results.prophet said:
How is that working out for ya? You honestly think you can do a better job than God? If you truly believe that God does not keep His own as promised, why serve Him? If religion depends wholly on you and you alone, why even bother? In such a case, He ain't there, turn the lights out and go home.prophet said:
But yes, God is there, and His promises are true. Your problem appears to be that you ignore the Bible. The problem is not the flesh of men, but the evil spirits controlling that flesh. That is where our true enemy lies. *IF* we do God's things God's way, it works out best. Taking your own control only brings repeated disaster.
That is what has me scratching my head, prophet. Where have I ever said that? I do believe in BALANCE, so that you do not only conduct an inquistion, or ignore rebuking sinning elders before all. Again, it is not properly an either/or situation where you can only do one or the other.prophet said:
I suspect that is going to happen any way you look at it, but certainly not because of me or my generation. I think it was David Cloud who wrote that he expects some 80% or better of your HAC "fundamentalists" will go emergent. I don't know where anyone comes up with the percentages, but having experienced first hand the priority that HAC and other "colleges" within its same orbit places upon the practical over the spiritual and flesh over faith, I suspect a large percentage will go that way. Satan's trap is not the fall of JS, he did that himself and it should have been obvious to you and your generation, but you guys were willfully blind UNTIL ...prophet said:
That is where I have my greatest problem with this set of posts. Why don't you answer your own question, prophet? Where exactly was God? From my point of view, He has been on the throne the entire time. It is only someone whose faith is near crushed that asks such a question.prophet said:
The reason why the situation will repeat itself is because of this kind of reaction from people like you. You allowed it to happen because you did not see it unfolding, did not expect it, and would not listen to those before who tried to call out a warning. But instead of confessing your own sin, you become so busy at pointing fingers away from yourself that you ignore the whole set of circumstances starting over. Schaap only retraced the steps of his Father in Law. And Hyles was not without public rebuke and separation from my generation. The problem is not the individuals, but the system of hiding sin, ignoring proper discipline within the entire body (not just "the leadership" and not just "the followers"), and ignoring God in the entire situation as if He does not exist. Within that system, religion becomes a game, and the goal is only control and power.
You asked me earlier why God did not step in and remove JH? Simply because God is patient and uses such to His own purposes (Rom 9:22). Just like in the days of Jeremiah and apostate Judah. Sure, the LORD could have removed Manasseh, but that would not have accomplished what He wanted. Why? Because Manasseh was a symptom, not the problem. The hearts of the people as a whole was the problem. And despite God sending forth many prophets to warn of judgment and rebuke the false prophets, the people ignored it all as just a religious game like all the other "gods" around about. In process of time, Nebuchadnezzar came, God's tool of judgment.
And in process of time, The Biblical Evangelist and Robert Sumner came to JH. The LORD does not play favorites like Hyles thought He did. You can never accumulate enough merits for God to ignore such demerits, regardless of how big a numbers you claim to have won or how many miles you claim to have flown, nor how many hours you have claimed to work per week for many weeks.
He that covereth his sins shall not prosper... Just like reaping what you sow, it is a Bible truth and there ain't no way to get around it.