All Creatures Great and Small

[DrHuk&Duck]

My goodness. Did I really spell wean with two e's? Oh well. It was late and I made the foolish decision to have some coffee at 9 pm last night.

Don’t worry, this is not English 101. I’m not here to judge spelling and grammar. I just use my phone for the forum, not sitting on a keyboard.

Mumbles is Sub. Ever try to pronounce his handle? I know that it's mr bill bus spelled backwards, but still, his handle isn't mr bill bus. I first dubbed him The Biden Mumble in an interaction with his sanctimonious never-Trumpism, and then shortened it to Mumbles.

Why would I refer to A as 'Mumbles'? That doesn't make any sense.

OK, then my apologies for the misunderstanding. You have commented on her writing style in the past, so I thought that’s what you were doing again.

At any rate, the main motivation for sport hunting is self-evident, as I said. But if you're game (ha ha), agree to answer a series of questions truthfully, and the evidence you seek will emerge.

I’m still waiting on that empirical data or survey to back up your claim.

 

[Ekklesian]

I’m still waiting on that empirical data or survey to back up your claim.

I can offer better than that.

...agree to answer a series of questions truthfully, and the evidence you seek will emerge.

 

[DrHuk&Duck]

I can offer better than that.

In other words, you have zero evidence and are looking to prove your false claim by attempting to trip me up with some silly questions. I can save you the trouble. On the vast majority of my duck hunts, I drive away without even shooting my 12 gauge, and I’m perfectly content having been out seeing the sunrise or sunset on the water in God’s creation.

 

[Ekklesian]

In other words, you have zero evidence and are looking to prove your false claim by attempting to trip me up with some silly questions. I can save you the trouble. On the vast majority of my duck hunts, I drive away without even shooting my 12 gauge, and I’m perfectly content having been out seeing the sunrise or sunset on the water in God’s creation.

In your experience, would you say that's typical or atypical of duck hunters?

 

[DrHuk&Duck]

In your experience, would you say that's typical or atypical of duck hunters?

My circle of guys I hunt with is very small, and I actually prefer to hunt solo when possible. One guy I occasionally hunt with is my BIL. I know he shares my same sentiments. He hunts way more often than me. He’s shot enough ducks over the years that he only targets a specific duck now, and he’s okay going an entire season and not pulling the trigger unless he sees that one type of duck. The more common ducks he passes on. So I think it’d be hard for you to categorize him as bloodthirsty for killing.

By the way, the limits on ducks are so strict now that any sane person would never consider duck hunting for any reason other than enjoying the environment, or the camaraderie, or being in nature, etc. The duck I usually target is the scaup (bluebill). The limit in recent years is one bluebill per hunt for the first half of the season, and a max of two for the second half of the season. The few times a season I actually get a chance to hunt usually occur in phase one. Why go to all of the trouble and expense of hunting for a one duck limit?

 

[aleshanee]

In other words, you have zero evidence and are looking to prove your false claim by attempting to trip me up with some silly questions. I can save you the trouble. On the vast majority of my duck hunts, I drive away without even shooting my 12 gauge, and I’m perfectly content having been out seeing the sunrise or sunset on the water in God’s creation.

it;s the same with us.... ..we have come home from hunts empty handed many times... .. some times it was because we couldn;t get close enough to make a clean shot.... (that;s happening more and more often now that my dads arthritis and old injury issues have been flaring up).... sometimes it was because we had been contracted to kill a specific problem pig and it never showed.... .. ..other times we didn;t find the pigs until late in the afternoon on our last day there - and would not have been able to properly handle a kill in the time left.... ... and other times we only saw full grown sows and boars that were simply bigger than anything we felt like carrying out of the jungle... ...

but on all those hunts we counted it as a success and an awesome experience because we love being up there away from all signs of civilization - with the freedom to wander anywhere we had the skills to get back from....

anyone who hunts knows that no matter how hard the hunt may be - the real work begins once a kill is made and the animal has to be processed and butchered....... .... when we kill a pig we gut it on the spot.... then tie it;s front legs to it;s back legs on each side and wear it like a back pack..... it can be messy trek down the mountain but it;s about the only way one person can carry a full grown pig carcass by themselves... . the other person has to carry the rest of the gear...... after that we usually take it to our hawaiian friends in waimalanlo to cook in their pemanent emu... (open pit lined with stone for cooking)... ...we pay them by giving a large portion of the meat...

 

[DrHuk&Duck]

it;s the same with us.... ..we have come home from hunts empty handed many times... .. some times it was because we couldn;t get close enough to make a clean shot.... (that;s happening more and more often now that my dads arthritis and old injury issues have been flaring up).... sometimes it was because we had been contracted to kill a specific problem pig and it never showed.... .. ..other times we didn;t find the pigs until late in the afternoon on our last day there - and would not have been able to properly handle a kill in the time left.... ... and other times we only saw full grown sows and boars that were simply bigger than anything we felt like carrying out of the jungle... ...

but on all those hunts we counted it as a success and an awesome experience because we love being up there away from all signs of civilization - with the freedom to wander anywhere we had the skills to get back from....

anyone who hunts knows that no matter how hard the hunt may be - the real work begins once a kill is made and the animal has to be processed and butchered....... .... when we kill a pig we gut it on the spot.... then tie it;s front legs to it;s back legs on each side and wear it like a back pack..... it can be messy trek down the mountain but it;s about the only way one person can carry a full grown pig carcass by themselves... . the other person has to carry the rest of the gear...... after that we usually take it to our hawaiian friends in waimalanlo to cook in their pemanent emu... (open pit lined with stone for cooking)... ...we pay them by giving a large portion of the meat...

It’s obvious Ekk knows as much about hunting as I do about astrophysics. Duck hunters are notorious snitches. Almost every decent hunter has a game warden’s phone number on speed dial. On those rare occasions that a guy with an attitude of “if it flies it dies” show up, you can bet he’s getting checked out by the wildlife officer and he’s being spied on with binoculars. They will fine a rule breaker (in the thou$ands) and jail time is definitely on the table depending on the situation. We want to protect our sport/hobby, and we want birds to live and continue to migrate. The duck kill limits are so low that it’s almost impossible to be bloodthirsty.

 

[aleshanee]

But not more than countless children have.

Do you have any research links to confirm that it's the desire of the vast majority? I personally wasn't involved in a survey on the subject but if I had been I would be in the vast minority.

While what you say is true, I don't understand why you feel the need to discount her experiences.

thanks subllibrm....

How does the truth discount her experiences, except to take away the license to falsely accuse and otherwise engage in hostile and otherwise bad behavior?

the truth is i am very well aware that there are countless women out there who had the same experiences of being sexually abused in early childhood as i did.... i am also aware that most of them were never blessed as i was and taken in by a christian family... ....most all of the women i work with in the outreach ministry and anti-trafficking ministry were sexually abused as a child at one time... and many are still at risk.... .

.almost all have the same mental and emotional issues i have - some to an even greater degree.... .... and some have the same internal physical limitations too... ..coz in addition to the emotional and mental damage - children don;t just walk away from being sexaully abused by an adult without also sustaining heavy and permament physical damage.... .especially when that abuse was repetitive over a number of years....

and then there were also hundred of thousands of children abused in such ways that did not survive... .some were killed by their own abusers...and some took their own lives..... i knew some that died by that latter method... and almost died that way myself....

if any of that causes me to react to people in ways they think are hostile or which make them uncomfortable i do sincerely apologize.... it has never been my intention to use my past to excuse my own bad behavior... .... and as far as you are concerned ekklesian - i have apologized to people on these forums for going over the edge and saying innappropriate things to them far more often than you have....... in fact - i can;t remember a single time you have done that here..... .. and your manner of speech towards people here has been degrading... condescending ... and even caustic and hostile on many occasions...

but i have not falsely accused you.... . and i will address that in greater detail later when i answer the filibuster post you made above.... ......

 

[Ekklesian]

It’s obvious Ekk knows as much about hunting as I do about astrophysics. Duck hunters are notorious snitches. Almost every decent hunter has a game warden’s phone number on speed dial. On those rare occasions that a guy with an attitude of “if it flies it dies” show up, you can bet he’s getting checked out by the wildlife officer and he’s being spied on with binoculars. They will fine a rule breaker (in the thou$ands) and jail time is definitely on the table depending on the situation. We want to protect our sport/hobby, and we want birds to live and continue to migrate. The duck kill limits are so low that it’s almost impossible to be bloodthirsty.

In one post you imply you couldn't generalize about duck hunters, and in this one you do.

Duck hunters are notorious snitches.​

​

Are limits imposed because duck hunters are famous for self-restraint, enjoying God's creation and leaving with empty bags?

 

[aleshanee]

Do you have any research links to confirm that it's the desire of the vast majority? I personally wasn't involved in a survey on the subject but if I had been I would be in the vast minority.

I’m a hunter and I wasn’t surveyed either.

and i have never been surveyed either about my reasons for wanting to hunt..... not even when i filled out the application for a hunting license.... ... but i can tell you what the state of hawaii lists my reason for hunting as being...... i am licensed as a wildlife control and invasive mammal hunter... . specifically licensed to hunt feral pigs and goats because the populations of both got out of control..... ... .and i;m authorized to use archery as my method for hunting..... and authorized to hunt year round...... i also have special area permits coded onto my license to access all hunting areas even those off limits to the general public.. .all of that is printed and coded onto the license itself......... .. and then we also have keys to gates and authorized access to some of the military property for the purposes of hunting feral animals too...

the only tag/permission code i don;t have on my license is permission to hunt game birds or feral invasive birds... .. it;s even more strictly regulated and complicated than a license to hunt feral mammals is... .. and i just wasn;t intersted at the time.... i;m still not..... i would not have any idea what to do with a duck or francolin quail after shooting it... besides most of that kind of hunting is done on other islands and done with guns... ... and i;m prohibited from using them... or even having access to them .... just another part of the hawaii mental health laws...... .

(edit and addendum).... i almost forgot to add..... although we do not have a bag limit and can harvest as many feral hogs as we are able - we are required to report each hog we kill and list it;s final disposition...... it helps the state keep an accurate count of the numbers.... . that;s pretty much it......
. .

 

[Ekklesian]

thanks subllibrm....

the truth is i am very well aware that there are countless women out there who had the same experiences of being sexually abused in early childhood as i did.... i am also aware that most of them were never blessed as i was and taken in by a christian family... ....most all of the women i work with in the outreach ministry and anti-trafficking ministry were sexually abused as a child at one time... and many are still at risk.... .

.almost all have the same mental and emotional issues i have - some to an even greater degree.... .... and some have the same internal physical limitations too... ..coz in addition to the emotional and mental damage - children don;t just walk away from being sexaully abused by an adult without also sustaining heavy and permament physical damage.... .especially when that abuse was repetitive over a number of years....

and then there were also hundred of thousands of children abused in such ways that did not survive... .some were killed by their own abusers...and some took their own lives..... i knew some that died by that latter method... and almost died that way myself....

if any of that causes me to react to people in ways they think are hostile or which make them uncomfortable i do sincerely apologize.... it has never been my intention to use my past to excuse my own bad behavior... .... and as far as you are concerned ekklesian - i have apologized to people on these forums for going over the edge and saying innappropriate things to them far more often than you have....... in fact - i can;t remember a single time you have done that here..... .. and your manner of speech towards people here has been degrading... condescending ... and even caustic and hostile on many occasions...

but i have not falsely accused you.... . and i will address that in greater detail later when i answer the filibuster post you made above.... ......

I'm not interested in any more of your excuses, to be honest. I'll still engage you on topics, but stop making everything about you.

 

[aleshanee]

I'm not interested in any more of your excuses, to be honest. I'll still engage you on topics, but stop making everything about you.

wow..... talk about hostility.... and a total cop-out..... . you seriously need to see a therapist... . coz obviously your pastor - guru - peta-gaia worshiping swami ...or whatever you see isn;t doing you any good...... .....

i didn;t make any of this about me.... you did... you attacked me for having an interest in bullfighting then tried to say the only reason women wanted to be involved in it was "showing off their bods"..... when i defended myself and them on that account i did not bring anything up about past abuse...... . your comments about women all through that thread and now this one have been sick and disgusting.......

but what you got your nose outta joint now over - started when all jo did was aknowledge i had experienced more than a child should have... .and that was in response to something i wrote in respone when huk wrote about a guy he knows who can;t hunt because of his own bad experiences....(memories of witnessing an animal being butchered)..i explained why i had no problem hunting even in light of my experiences.... ...and all i did at the time in regard to what jo said was thank her and wish her Gods blessings..........

but now you are using the whole thing like a chip on your shoulder and taking personal license to say anything and everything you want - then claiming i have no right to fight back..... ......that;s the same thing people who were perpetrators once themselves do...... they do anything and everything they can to discredit former victims even if those people weren;t their own victims...... .... and that mr ekklesian is why my dad said you reminded him of dave hyles... ..

now.... i am not accusing you of being a former perp or of being dave hyles either one..... i am just asking you to take a good look at yourself and consider how you are coming across..... then ask yourself why...... .. you have an instant reaction of anger and defensiveness against the victim any time you hear or read of someone who was sexually abused....... ..even when you don;t know the person ....and even when you were not a part of the original conversation or incident being discussed.... you did that the first time you and i ever spoke to each other when i mentioned the history of 2 girls i had been in a group therapy session with....... remember that?.... you said they were probably running away coz they were to blame....why did you do that?......

ofcourse if past history repeats itself you will run cry boo-hoody-hoo to admin and claim you are being "unfairly and relentlessly dogged".... .i won;t be surprised by that... .though i would like to see something more constructive....

 

[aleshanee]

It’s obvious Ekk knows as much about hunting as I do about astrophysics. Duck hunters are notorious snitches. Almost every decent hunter has a game warden’s phone number on speed dial. On those rare occasions that a guy with an attitude of “if it flies it dies” show up, you can bet he’s getting checked out by the wildlife officer and he’s being spied on with binoculars. They will fine a rule breaker (in the thou$ands) and jail time is definitely on the table depending on the situation. We want to protect our sport/hobby, and we want birds to live and continue to migrate. The duck kill limits are so low that it’s almost impossible to be bloodthirsty.

the department of land and national resources guys here are stretched pretty thin...... .so they tell us to report people hunting illegally... especially if they are using unsafe or unauthorized methods... . and they rely on us to do it..... ...it;s actually part of the agreement we sign to get our hunting license that we will do all we can to preserve the native wildlife and environment and report abuses and/or damage when we see it..... ... ....but in truth we haven;t seen much of it.... ...most of the illegal activity occurs at night... and we are strictly daytime hunters.... . it;s too dangerous to be running around at night in the places we go... ..even kaau crater was notoriously dangrous at night - as a few unfortunate hikers who decided to spend the night have discovered in the past few years.....

 

[aleshanee]

.......

(There can be no rational argument about bullfighting. That's just cruel, appeals to illusions of the 'warrior princess' notwithstanding.)

.....

just curious....... where or who did you learn about that old nickname from?... .....someone on the old forum nicknamed me that years ago after reading about an incident during one of our hunting trips.... ..... but it hasn;t been used - at least not that i have seen - in many years.... and not on this forum at all.... i have never used it or called myself that.... .......... ...care to explain?..... is someone behind the scenes or hidden from view feeding you info?

 

[aleshanee]

tyAnd yet you can't exposit them well enough to tell me or anyone here how my view of the Scriptures is twisted.

it;s a narcissistic view of the scriptures and virtually everything else in life.... which explains both your hyper-calvinism and general disdian for other people.....

Yes it is. In more than one place, but even if it weren't, it's unquestionably implied throughout. You are still responsible to the implications of Scripture. The Pentateuch has no direct statement on the Resurrection. Yet Jesus said, "Have ye not read" how God said to Moses, I am the God of Abraham, of Isaac, and of Jacob? He is not the God of the dead, but of the living. Ye do greatly err.

Honestly, isn't it you who's relying on biases to avoid having to justify your positions? We wouldn't even be here if your head didn't explode over the mere suggestion that the activity of your matadoras was cruel and unattractive.

When he should have had a burden for the souls of Ninevites. His sorrow over the gourd was misplaced and therefore ungodly. but where in the world do you get the idea that I've consigned anyone to hell? I think you're projecting. I think it's you who thinks that anyone who is not in your view a perfect angel is a devil.

more narcissism combined with projection..... you attempt to accuse others of the very thing you are guilty of yourself....

*sigh*

Here we go again. I don't know how many ways I can say it. There are no children in hell. Neither are there any in Heaven. But hold on to your cherished biases and the lie of a way to the Father other than by grace through faith in Jesus Christ.


There are no children burning in hell. Earth is the only place a child can burn, but if finding animal cruelty unbecoming especially for a woman is crying, so be it.

more twisting turning and playing semantic word games.... fine - i;ll take the word in contention out of it.. .....what i gathered from what you wrote is that you believe ... humans.. who are born on earth... then die in infancy - even though they do not yet know right from wrong - but are not elect - will burn in hell... ...... . ... ....if that;s a misconception on my part then it;s an easy thing for you to fix..... just say you believe all humans... who are present on earth as children ...and who die in infancy before they know right from wrong will be in heaven......... maybe i;m wrong but i thought i saw you argue against that kind of statement here before...... ...

I post nothing on the Internet I wouldn't want my dear Pentecostal mother to see, let alone my daughter. If she were to read this interaction, she would say you were being somewhat...what is that Gen Z word?...ah, yes...'cringe.'

you have it totally backwards..... you are not raising your dear pentecostal mother..... things you write that she sees might embarrass her ... but it will not influence who she becomes in the future... she is an adult already grown..... ... but things your daughter sees you do and hears you say are far more important and can carry much greater consequences.... ... most normal fathers of daughters would already know that without being told.......

If asked if I were the photographer, which of the photos of the matadoras I would have published, she would say the one on horseback.

Indeed the photo I replied to, in neither a lewd nor crude manner at all, is the one in which both the matadora and the horse were captured in an elegant and stately pose, and we're at least treated to an interesting angle of her lovely countenance. The roundness of her butt isn't the point of interest or even visible. I know you know, so don't try to deny it, that no one is, or would be first interested in the animal, or any other feature of the woman in the frame in the other photos. The compositions force it.

Now my daughter would say there's absolutely nothing wrong with that, but she also wouldn't feign indignance when a viewer didn't pretend not to notice, or that a 170 pound Nanny McPhee in their place wouldn't be absolutely ridiculous.

this is a really sickening set of paragraphs.... which does nothing more than prove what i was saying is true........ what i see in photos of those female matadoras.... (both of whom i have known for many years).... is women mastering a dangerous cultural and traditonal skill that only men were able to master in the not too distant past...... it shows their courage and ability.....

.... .. and the reason you won;t see any men or women either one in the arena that are over weight or out of shape is because you have to be physically fit - able to move fast - and have quick reactions to even survive out there..... .anything that slows a matador or matadora down can be fatal to them...........

what you said about that first picture i posted of lea vicens on horseback was that she was "hot".... but her activity there was "unladylike"..... all of it together proves that not only do you know nothing about bullfighting but you also know nothing about why a woman like her would want to take part in it.....

LOL. Deep thinking is apparently no prerequisite for deep sea diving or deep sea fishing.

how would you know?.... you have never done either one.... .. and so far your attempts at "deep thinking" have yielded dubious results ...but a fine display of mental gymnastics none the less......

Almost forgot. Happy Easter!

thank you.... and i hope you had a happy easter too.....

 

[DrHuk&Duck]

In one post you imply you couldn't generalize about duck hunters, and in this one you do.

Duck hunters are notorious snitches.​

​

Are limits imposed because duck hunters are famous for self-restraint, enjoying God's creation and leaving with empty bags?

I can only answer for duck hunters I actually know, which as I said, is a small circle in one little corner of Florida. I can’t tell you how duck hunters in California or Kansas or Canada behave. But what I do know is that hunting is a dying pastime in America and I’d assume Canada. In many parts of Europe, of course, it’s essentially an extinct activity due to strict gun laws and loss of open spaces. I can actually back up my rhetoric with data: https://cnr.ncsu.edu/news/2021/01/decline-hunting-conservation-funding/

I’m assuming you know that young people aren’t hunting in the 21st century because it’s difficult to handle a shotgun and a phone or game console at the same time. Plus, it’s not exactly “woke” to go out and kill your dinner. Someone might accuse you of being a bloodthirsty conservative Republican or something like that.

 

[Jo]

How does the truth discount her experiences, except to take away the license to falsely accuse and otherwise engage in hostile and otherwise bad behavior?

WHAT?????!!!

Are you a troll?

 

[DrHuk&Duck]

the department of land and national resources guys here are stretched pretty thin...... .so they tell us to report people hunting illegally... especially if they are using unsafe or unauthorized methods... . and they rely on us to do it..... ...it;s actually part of the agreement we sign to get our hunting license that we will do all we can to preserve the native wildlife and environment and report abuses and/or damage when we see it..... ... ....but in truth we haven;t seen much of it.... ...most of the illegal activity occurs at night... and we are strictly daytime hunters.... . it;s too dangerous to be running around at night in the places we go... ..even kaau crater was notoriously dangrous at night - as a few unfortunate hikers who decided to spend the night have discovered in the past few years.....

I think we’re required to do the same with reporting. Ekk lumps all hunters together, but the truth is hunters are a diverse group. I’ve only been pig hunting once in my life, so I can’t speak for them, but the state is very supportive of boar hunting because they are invasive and tearing up everything from golf courses to state forests. I’m not a land hunter, so it’s just not my thing. Same with deer hunting. Years ago I went a couple times with a friend. We never saw a deer and I found it boring, so it’s not my thing. Again, I just prefer hunting on the water. However, although I can’t necessarily speak for guys who hunt other species, the ones I’ve had conversations with have always given me the impression that they mainly enjoyed getting in nature and the anticipation of getting the “big buck” or the “fat boar.” Unless a guy is wealthy with a lot of land, nearly everyone is hunting state WMAs and they’re usually lucky if they get one deer a season. Maybe in other states the success rate is higher, but I don’t think in Florida it is. And on public lands, it’s illegal to put out bait or feeders, so that’s why it’s so difficult. On private property where they have hunting clubs and leases, it’s not as strict.

 

[DrHuk&Duck]

I'm not interested in any more of your excuses, to be honest. I'll still engage you on topics, but stop making everything about you.

Children aren’t responsible for what adults do to them—right or wrong. That’s not an excuse, it’s just her life’s experiences.

 

[Ekklesian]

just curious....... where or who did you learn about that old nickname from?... .....someone on the old forum nicknamed me that years ago after reading about an incident during one of our hunting trips.... ..... but it hasn;t been used - at least not that i have seen - in many years.... and not on this forum at all.... i have never used it or called myself that.... .......... ...care to explain?..... is someone behind the scenes or hidden from view feeding you info?

I can see where you might conclude that I was referring to you personally with that, but I wasn't. I was referring to the portrait you drew of the femme tueuse d'animaux in your tirade about ladylikeness. Knowing your penchant for making everything about you, I probably could have been more circumspect in my wording, but I've grown weary of having to walk on eggshells around you.

I watched Xena Warrior Princess when UPN was a thing. That's where I learned the title.

You must be disappointed that I'm not engaged in a conspiracy with a ghost from your past intimidated by the power of your Feminism to stalk and waylay you from the shadows. That would be more interesting and dramatic. You'll just have to accept the fact that our encounter was completely by chance...untill you come to the realization of the truth of Calvinism, then you could presume our encounter was divinely appointed, but for other than sinister reasons.

There's the explanation. Accept it or reject it. I care not.