Misrepresentations to Impressionable Students

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GeneFrenkle

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There were some statements made during my time at HAC that I have come to resent.  I'm also glad I was around people who point out some realities when I was there.

How about Ray Young?  "I'm at the college at 4am".  Didn't tell you that he was in bed before the sun went down, staff to take care of his tasks, and took naps in his office during the day.  There was always an implication that the less sleep you had the more spiritual you were.  Jesus took naps.

How about Larry Smith?  "I donate my salary back to the college".  No background whatsoever.  Owns a construction business that's making him pretty good money.  Why not state this?  Speaking of him, is he still around?

How about Pete Cowling?  "I took a $XXX,XXX paycut to go from UT to HAC".  Owned trailer parks that gave him a pretty good income.  Side income isn't a bad thing.  Just be honest.

Darrell Moore?  "You think you're busy now, wait until you're in full-time ministry".  Never a more discouraging and FALSE statement in my time there.  I was ready to quit that day.  Ministry has never been even half as busy as I was in college.

I realize these are somewhat petty, but they have always bothered me.  It's not quite lying, but pretty close.  Why set yourself up as something you're not?  Then you have 18-22 year-old students running around trying to replicate your "faith" and failing miserably because they lack the whole story.

What are yours?
 
Also, I wonder if Darrell Moore ever ties his lack of sleep and being overworked at HAC to his drastic health decline of the last decade or so.
 
GeneFrenkle said:
There were some statements made during my time at HAC that I have come to resent.  I'm also glad I was around people who point out some realities when I was there.

How about Ray Young?  "I'm at the college at 4am".  Didn't tell you that he was in bed before the sun went down, staff to take care of his tasks, and took naps in his office during the day.  There was always an implication that the less sleep you had the more spiritual you were.  Jesus took naps.

How about Larry Smith?  "I donate my salary back to the college".  No background whatsoever.  Owns a construction business that's making him pretty good money.  Why not state this?  Speaking of him, is he still around?

How about Pete Cowling?  "I took a $XXX,XXX paycut to go from UT to HAC".  Owned trailer parks that gave him a pretty good income.  Side income isn't a bad thing.  Just be honest.

Darrell Moore?  "You think you're busy now, wait until you're in full-time ministry".  Never a more discouraging and FALSE statement in my time there.  I was ready to quit that day.  Ministry has never been even half as busy as I was in college.

I realize these are somewhat petty, but they have always bothered me.  It's not quite lying, but pretty close.  Why set yourself up as something you're not?  Then you have 18-22 year-old students running around trying to replicate your "faith" and failing miserably because they lack the whole story.

What are yours?
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Good points all. 
 
cpizzle said:
I was told that girls never said no to a first date.....I found out that was a lie :)
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Only to you, bro.
 
And then there's JH constantly stating/preaching that "I never take a day off."

I worked for a HACker as an assistant pastor who gave me so much stuff to do that I thought, well I guess I have to put in 7 days a week too & did. Within 7-8 months I had a physical breakdown & was told if I didn't take a month off & after that a day off per week, I would die of a heart attack before I was 30. 

Checkout JH's schedule in "Let's build an evangelistic church." Written while still in Texas.
 
Twisted said:
cpizzle said:
I was told that girls never said no to a first date.....I found out that was a lie :)
Click to expand...

Only to you, bro.
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That's what I was thinking.

Sent from my H1611 using Tapatalk

 
I had a room mate who kept insulting people because he only slept six hours per night. Later, he quietly went back to eight hours.

Physically, some people can get by on six hours per night but the Scriptures do not attribute that to spirituality.
 
The Staff spent several hours saturday morning getting the students rallied to do what they have long since ceased to...causing the disconnect to lend to tyranny.

Sent from my H1611 using Tapatalk

 
Bro. Hyles (in his own way) was smooth, relatable and convincing. Back in the late 70's I talked with a young pastor who was attending Pastor's School and he said this, "The difference between Jack Hyles and Dave Hyles is when I hear Jack and his story, I think 'if he can do it, so can I!'. When I hear Dave I think "I could never do all that he does!'"

Even today, I think of one of Jack's philosophies - "I will not use my people to build my ministry, I will use my ministry to build my people."

Forty-five years later, that's precisely what I believe Jack Hyles did -- he used "his people" to build his ministry. I believe that if he had a "besetting sin" it was pride.

I wrote something similar in another post, but I really believe that when the brain storm of starting a college became a reality in Hammond, that was the beginning of the fall of Jack Hyles. He had already built a super church, but when he was able to enlist 2000 "students" and essentially order them to ministry work until they reached their bloody limit, it became a truly MEGA church.

Think about a church that has 2000 young members, true believers, that will work constantly on your ministry. You WILL see huge results. There is a non-denominational church in my area that has become one of the largest churches in the country in the past twenty years. About 7-8 years ago they started a non-accredited college. They are working those kids to death and the church has blown up in growth.

Anyway, I think when the college came along, the numbers went out the roof and think about it -- they NEVER failed to meet a goal on a big day push, but they were always slippery with the numbers, too! I think the counters are currently ballot counters in blue states. We just keep counting until we get the number we want! :LOL:
 
Justice1976 said:
Bro. Hyles (in his own way) was smooth, relatable and convincing. Back in the late 70's I talked with a young pastor who was attending Pastor's School and he said this, "The difference between Jack Hyles and Dave Hyles is when I hear Jack and his story, I think 'if he can do it, so can I!'. When I hear Dave I think "I could never do all that he does!'"

Even today, I think of one of Jack's philosophies - "I will not use my people to build my ministry, I will use my ministry to build my people."

Forty-five years later, that's precisely what I believe Jack Hyles did -- he used "his people" to build his ministry. I believe that if he had a "besetting sin" it was pride.

I wrote something similar in another post, but I really believe that when the brain storm of starting a college became a reality in Hammond, that was the beginning of the fall of Jack Hyles. He had already built a super church, but when he was able to enlist 2000 "students" and essentially order them to ministry work until they reached their bloody limit, it became a truly MEGA church.

Think about a church that has 2000 young members, true believers, that will work constantly on your ministry. You WILL see huge results. There is a non-denominational church in my area that has become one of the largest churches in the country in the past twenty years. About 7-8 years ago they started a non-accredited college. They are working those kids to death and the church has blown up in growth.

Anyway, I think when the college came along, the numbers went out the roof and think about it -- they NEVER failed to meet a goal on a big day push, but they were always slippery with the numbers, too! I think the counters are currently ballot counters in blue states. We just keep counting until we get the number we want! :LOL:
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Looks like the Non-Denom's got into a fundy practice! Maybe the pastor went to Pastor's School or bought one of Dr. Hyle's' books. Anyway, blame it on Jack Hyles. He started it all.
 
I don't attend the church. I did visit there some about 11 years ago, but it is somewhat amusing to me. In many ways it's the modern version of us HACers, fifty years ago.

The male students don't wear ties, they wear skinny jeans and sneakers. They raise their hands and sing praise songs. They work these kids at their satellite campuses all over the state. I know one young man in particular. He says he's going into the ministry and while I can tell that he's sincere, he thinks the ministry is cool and it's going to provide him a nice life of footlights, smoke machines and a good band along with a cute wife and three kids who will one day smile for their pic while on a picnic so the church will have something to put on his bio page.

Frankly, I can't think of a harder life than the ministry. But youth doesn't know.

I can't say that I believe that age has brought me great wisdom, but simply that I've seen a lot. And most of what I see these days concerns me deeply.
 
Justice1976 said:
I don't attend the church. I did visit there some about 11 years ago, but it is somewhat amusing to me. In many ways it's the modern version of us HACers, fifty years ago.

The male students don't wear ties, they wear skinny jeans and sneakers. They raise their hands and sing praise songs. They work these kids at their satellite campuses all over the state. I know one young man in particular. He says he's going into the ministry and while I can tell that he's sincere, he thinks the ministry is cool and it's going to provide him a nice life of footlights, smoke machines and a good band along with a cute wife and three kids who will one day smile for their pic while on a picnic so the church will have something to put on his bio page.

Frankly, I can't think of a harder life than the ministry. But youth doesn't know.

I can't say that I believe that age has brought me great wisdom, but simply that I've seen a lot. And most of what I see these days concerns me deeply.
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"Frankly, I can't think of a harder life than the ministry. But youth doesn't know."


Hopefully, it gives a person a sense of purpose because they get to minister to people as a vocation. One of the problems is that we know too many cases where the pastor has had the people minister to his needs and wants, instead of the other way around.

I am thankful for the light-bearers, the ones who demonstrate God's love and righteousness.
 
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