Josh Hamilton relapses....dealing with struggling Christians.

I wish more preachers would be real with the church and honest about their struggles instead of always acting like they have everything together yet we hear stories of preachers being taught the exact opposite.  I think that is sad...both for the pastor and the church. They rob each othe of a blessing.

To this case specifically I don't think he should continue to speak as a high profile individual in the near future as anything other than a fellow traveler on the recovery road with other addicts trying to go the right way.  But for this event, he was already booked and I think it sends a terrible message to disinvite him. Rather use this time to love on him as an example to others who struggle similarly that they can find acceptance and hope in the church. Just make sure that is true of all and not just a celebrity.
 
Just John said:
I wish more preachers would be real with the church and honest about their struggles instead of always acting like they have everything together yet we hear stories of preachers being taught the exact opposite.  I think that is sad...both for the pastor and the church. They rob each othe of a blessing.

To this case specifically I don't think he should continue to speak as a high profile individual in the near future as anything other than a fellow traveler on the recovery road with other addicts trying to go the right way.  But for this event, he was already booked and I think it sends a terrible message to disinvite him. Rather use this time to love on him as an example to others who struggle similarly that they can find acceptance and hope in the church. Just make sure that is true of all and not just a celebrity.
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Agreed on both counts.  Transparency and humility in a preacher are first order traits, as anything else is hypocritcal and prideful. 

And I wouldn't have disinvited Hamilton either.  I don't think his speaking at the event was sinful, nor even necessarily wrong, but unwise given the timing.  One article from a sportswriter I read (one who was fairly critical of Hamilton in regards to his sports liability) described the event and Hamilton's demeanor as that of somebody who treated his failure and shortcoming as not that big of a deal.  The sportswriter claimed that Hamilton's words expressed thankfulness that God is always there to pick him up when he falls.  To you and me (and most Christians) that resonates as grace, but to some, it may appear as callous or presumption.  I will say that his explanation for why he didn't cancel in light of the facts surrounding his recent failure seemed legit, sincere, and honorable.
 
Good to see you Alayman. Not sure the ladies will say the same. LOL.  ;)

Yes but as typical, the unknowing or unbeliever will often not understand or willfully ignore God's grace. We wil always face that.
 
Just John said:
Good to see you Alayman. Not sure the ladies will say the same. LOL.  ;)

Yes but as typical, the unknowing or unbeliever will often not understand or willfully ignore God's grace. We wil always face that.
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Well, more allegations are slowly leaking out that his relapse was more than just an encounter with booze.  If the claims being made, that he had intimate relations with a woman in a bathroom stall at the bar, would your opinion change regarding whether he should have spoken at the conference?
 
Probably not for the fact the latter followed the first problem and this is a chance to rally around him and send the same message to others who struggle. You did wrong, you fell, but we love you and we want to help you. He should not take any other stance than reality and humilty
 
Just John said:
Probably not for the fact the latter followed the first problem and this is a chance to rally around him and send the same message to others who struggle. You did wrong, you fell, but we love you and we want to help you. He should not take any other stance than reality and humilty
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Doesn't it make a mockery of the process of restoration if he is billed as a headliner for conferences as a speaker and example?  Wouldn't it be better to pray for him while he lays low?  Ted Haggard is the extreme example of somebody who was told to be restored in a spirit of meekness, and told to play low-key roles in the process, but rather than do that he seeks to build an audience by going on Oprah and other attention-getting venues.  When a child gets caught with their hand in the cookie jar they shouldn't immediately be taken to Willy Wonka's Chocolate Factory to celebrate their confession of the sin.
 
ALAYMAN said:
Just John said:
Probably not for the fact the latter followed the first problem and this is a chance to rally around him and send the same message to others who struggle. You did wrong, you fell, but we love you and we want to help you. He should not take any other stance than reality and humilty
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Doesn't it make a mockery of the process of restoration if he is billed as a headliner for conferences as a speaker and example?  Wouldn't it be better to pray for him while he lays low?  Ted Haggard is the extreme example of somebody who was told to be restored in a spirit of meekness, and told to play low-key roles in the process, but rather than do that he seeks to build an audience by going on Oprah and other attention-getting venues.  When a child gets caught with their hand in the cookie jar they shouldn't immediately be taken to Willy Wonka's Chocolate Factory to celebrate their confession of the sin.




That last sentence is great.
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ALAYMAN said:
Just John said:
Probably not for the fact the latter followed the first problem and this is a chance to rally around him and send the same message to others who struggle. You did wrong, you fell, but we love you and we want to help you. He should not take any other stance than reality and humilty
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Doesn't it make a mockery of the process of restoration if he is billed as a headliner for conferences as a speaker and example?  Wouldn't it be better to pray for him while he lays low?  Ted Haggard is the extreme example of somebody who was told to be restored in a spirit of meekness, and told to play low-key roles in the process, but rather than do that he seeks to build an audience by going on Oprah and other attention-getting venues.  When a child gets caught with their hand in the cookie jar they shouldn't immediately be taken to Willy Wonka's Chocolate Factory to celebrate their confession of the sin.
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A couple of stark differences here:

In this case as far as the details are known Hamilton was already invited and accepted to speak at the church before his relapse. I'm guessing but from what I have known of him (he grew up where I live and we hear some local news of him) he won't be speaking in such public events or at least as as anything other than, "Hi, I'm Josh and I am a fellow struggler with addiction" type of thing. He should deal with personal restoration for a time IMO but just not be ash-canned from this event where he was already invited.

The case against Haggard - He was preaching against the evils of drugs and homosexuality while he was secretly involved in the same. Hamilton was very public with his issue and let it be know it was still a struggle he needed to guard against, having an accountability partner/coach travel with him most of the time. It was very public that his team didn't participate in the on-field celebrations with alcoholic beverages in deference to him.

Haggard was a hypocrite while Hamilton struggled and fell IMO.  Haggard then didn't go into that good night quietly. He made a joke of his restoration, doing his sham HBO show while blaming evangelicals for a good deal of his problems and starting a church in the same city as his prior church....in direct disregard of his restoration process. He has now been on Celebrity Wife Swap. He doesn't seem too humble IMO.

I see two sinners whom Christ both died for but so far two very different attitudes in respect to their failures.
 
[quote author=Just John]A couple of stark differences here:

In this case as far as the details are known Hamilton was already invited and accepted to speak at the church before his relapse. I'm guessing but from what I have known of him (he grew up where I live and we hear some local news of him) he won't be speaking in such public events or at least as as anything other than, "Hi, I'm Josh and I am a fellow struggler with addiction" type of thing. He should deal with personal restoration for a time IMO but just not be ash-canned from this event where he was already invited.

The case against Haggard - He was preaching against the evils of drugs and homosexuality while he was secretly involved in the same. Hamilton was very public with his issue and let it be know it was still a struggle he needed to guard against, having an accountability partner/coach travel with him most of the time. It was very public that his team didn't participate in the on-field celebrations with alcoholic beverages in deference to him.

Haggard was a hypocrite while Hamilton struggled and fell IMO.  Haggard then didn't go into that good night quietly. He made a joke of his restoration, doing his sham HBO show while blaming evangelicals for a good deal of his problems and starting a church in the same city as his prior church....in direct disregard of his restoration process. He has now been on Celebrity Wife Swap. He doesn't seem too humble IMO.

I see two sinners whom Christ both died for but so far two very different attitudes in respect to their failures.
[/quote]


Fair enough. 

Time will tell if he handles it correctly.
 
ALAYMAN said:
http://www.glennbeck.com/2012/02/15/texas-rangers-star-athlete-josh-hamilton-opens-up-about-relapse-on-gbtv/

Hamilton spoke on the Glenn Beck show, reiterating that he's still a work in progress, coveting prayers of folk for his recovery and restitution.  That's cool, and now hopefully he can find the discernment to run like a bat out of hades from his charismatic kook of a SBC pastor James Robison.
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I don't agree with James Robinson on everything doctrinally but I have been in a position the last year or so to see some Christian leaders at a closer view...behind the scenes so to speak and seemingly he is the real deal...someone who does love the Lord but is more open and affirming of different of believers of a different stripe than most "fundamentalists". Interestingly, since Glenn Beck moved to TX Robinson says he hasn't missed one Sunday at his BAPTIST church.  That's a good start.
 
ALAYMAN said:
[quote author=BuckeyeBaptist]
Well better than intoxicated IN the Baptist church.
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Randy must be from one of those fermented wine in the Lord's Supper type churches. :D
[/quote]

Hey, I resemble that remark!  ;)

Good enough for Jesus, good enough for me.  ;D
 
Bro Blue said:
Ya'll were talking about celebrity christians and I thought of those two. Todd Bennick and the monster truck guy have been to our church and jumped buses and smashed cars respectively. Just wondering if you guys had heard of them.
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Nope, never heard of them.
 
[quote author=Just John]I don't agree with James Robinson on everything doctrinally but I have been in a position the last year or so to see some Christian leaders at a closer view...behind the scenes so to speak and seemingly he is the real deal...someone who does love the Lord but is more open and affirming of different of believers of a different stripe than most "fundamentalists".[/quote]

I don't think that it is merely "fundamentalists" that would distance themselves from Robisons penchant to drift into questionable theological beliefs and practices.  Such characterizations of my critique (and those like me) seem to come from an effort to marginalize dissenting conservative opinion.  Just one or two recent instances will demonstrate that though he may be "loving" and more "accepting" than us wart-nosed finger-pointing "fundys".  Cuddling up the Catholic Priest Jonathan Morris and attempting to forge relationships like Evangelicals and Catholics Together is not merely innocent ecumincalism, and saying that Beck has "accepted Jesus into his heart" is disingenuous, unless there's some renouncing of the Arian heresy (among others) that Beck's LDS family hold dear.  I'm not saying that everybody has to be an IFB KJVo Hell-fire and brimstone devil chasin' militant separatist, but Robison fails the sniff test of appropriate discernment and ecclesiastical line-blurring.  I hope Hamilton sees things more clearly than his pastor.  Doctrine divides, and it should, if rightly understood and applied.

Oh, and good to see you round here again bro.
 
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