Jonah and the salvation of the heathen.

Smellin Coffee said:
For answers, study Judaism or Islam.

For three different religions to be associated as having started with the same man convolutes the premise one of those faiths dominated another.
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SC:The faith of Abraham is the same faith of Christianity.
It isn't.

Please explain how the two are different.
 
Unlike Christianity, there was no "bible" from which Abraham got his theology. There was no acceptance of Jesus as Messiah. There was no Messianic resurrection account in Abraham's belief system. There was no salvation by grace through faith as he sought salvation through works. There was no belief in a trinitarian concept of deity. Christians view their lineage through Abraham through faith alone yet he saw lineage as biological.

Abrahamic faith was so obscure that to this day, the top three major religions claim Abraham as founder. So if Abraham can be considered Muslim AND Jew, he couldn't have been Christian enough.
 
Ransom said:
Christianity didn't exist in Jonah's day either.
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I can't believe I agree with you again, Ransom!

Either I'm going conservative or your coming over to the dark side! LOL!
 
Smellin Coffee said:
Unlike Christianity, there was no "bible" from which Abraham got his theology. There was no acceptance of Jesus as Messiah. There was no Messianic resurrection account in Abraham's belief system. There was no salvation by grace through faith as he sought salvation through works. There was no belief in a trinitarian concept of deity. Christians view their lineage through Abraham through faith alone yet he saw lineage as biological.

Abrahamic faith was so obscure that to this day, the top three major religions claim Abraham as founder. So if Abraham can be considered Muslim AND Jew, he couldn't have been Christian enough.
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Romans 4:3: For what does the Scripture say? “Abraham believed God, and it was credited to him as righteousness."
 
abcaines said:
Romans 4:3: For what does the Scripture say? “Abraham believed God, and it was credited to him as righteousness."
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Exactly. Christianity didn't come about until Paul.

Jesus wasn't a Christian either. ;)
 
voicecrying said:
Well, Christian = follower of Christ. Obviously, Jesus couldn't follow himself.
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I would contend that "Christian" is a Paul-follower.

The salvation messages of Paul and Jesus were not exactly identical.
 
voicecrying said:
The dictionary contends differently.

Paul & Jesus do not contradict one another.
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Point 1. So what? I was going by my opinion, not the dictionary.

Point 2. Yes they do differ, so much so that Paul was eventually abandoned by both Jewish AND Gentile Christians.
 
Smellin Coffee said:
Exactly. Christianity didn't come about until Paul.

Jesus wasn't a Christian either. ;)
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The same thing that justified Abraham back then justifies us today.

And without faith it is impossible to please God, because anyone who approaches Him must believe that He exists and that He rewards those who earnestly seek Him. Heb. 11:6
 
Smellin Coffee said:
Point 1. So what? I was going by my opinion, not the dictionary.

Point 2. Yes they do differ, so much so that Paul was eventually abandoned by both Jewish AND Gentile Christians.
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If we abandon the meaning of words, why even discuss anything?

Please elaborate on these differences.
 
abcaines said:
The same thing that justified Abraham back then justifies us today.

And without faith it is impossible to please God, because anyone who approaches Him must believe that He exists and that He rewards those who earnestly seek Him. Heb. 11:6
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Abraham didn't have faith in Jesus as the Messiah, much less the death and resurrection of such so that kinda convolutes the general NT salvation ideology.
 
Smellin Coffee said:
Abraham didn't have faith in Jesus as the Messiah, much less the death and resurrection of such so that kinda convolutes the general NT salvation ideology.
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In red letters no less:
Your father Abraham rejoiced that he would see my day. He saw it and was glad.
John 8:56
 
voicecrying said:
In red letters no less:
Your father Abraham rejoiced that he would see my day. He saw it and was glad.
John 8:56
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Yep, Abraham had foreknowledge of Jesus, not as a sacrifice but as one to set up the kingdom ("For he was looking forward to the city with foundations, whose architect and builder is God.") So now, it wasn't about "salvation for eternal life" but rather the establishment of an earthly reign.
 
Smellin Coffee said:
Yep, Abraham had foreknowledge of Jesus, not as a sacrifice but as one to set up the kingdom ("For he was looking forward to the city with foundations, whose architect and builder is God.") So now, it wasn't about "salvation for eternal life" but rather the establishment of an earthly reign.
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Did you not know that salvation does include believers living on a new earth?
 
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