Honorary Doctorates

[RAIDER]

On another thread the topic turned to honorary doctorates.  I believe this discussion deserves its own thread. 

BKW said that HAC would give an honorary doctorate to any preacher that sent 50 students to HAC.  Someone else added that they had to host a HAC tour group as well as attend Pastor's School.  I am asking BKW and Binaca if this is a fact or just something that they just tossed out there.

 

[RAIDER]

We know that HAC gave out Honorary Doctorates at graduation each year.  While some would like to think that HAC is the only college/university that does this, it is actually commonplace.  Here is the Wikipedia definition of an Honorary Doctorate (please note the bold print):

"An honorary degree[1] or a degree honoris causa (Latin: "for the sake of the honor") is an academic degree for which a university (or other degree-awarding institution) has waived the usual requirements, such as matriculation, residence, study and the passing of examinations. The degree is typically a doctorate or, less commonly, a master's degree, and may be awarded to someone who has no prior connection with the academic institution.[2]

The degree is often conferred as a way of honouring a distinguished visitor's contributions to a specific field or to society in general.[3] It is often given to graduation speakers at a university or college, and the university may derive benefits by association with the person in question. The degree is not recognized by employers as having the same stature as a corresponding earned doctorate degree and should not be represented as such. It is sometimes recommended that such degrees be listed in one's CV as an award and not in their education section.[4] With regard to the use of this honorific, the policies of institutions of higher education generally ask that recipients "refrain from adopting the misleading title"[5] and that a recipient of an honorary doctorate's use of the title "Dr" before his or her name should be restricted to engagement with the institution of higher education in question and not within the broader community.[6]"

 

[RAIDER]

I know that some considered it a weakness of Dr. Hyles, but I think we would all have to agree that he tried to lift up preachers in the eyes of those with whom he came in contact.  As he traveled around the nation he met up with preachers that were serving the Lord.  Many of these preachers were not well known.  Dr. Hyles brought them to HAC or Pastor's School and let them preach.

Some of these preachers had ministries that stood out.  Their churches were seeing many people saved and baptized and the church was growing.  I believe Dr. Hyles chose those who received an Honorary Doctorate from this group.

HAC is an IFB school for training IFB preachers.  Would it not make sense that they would give an Honorary Doctorate to an IFB preacher?  Now, does every preacher who received an Honorary Doctorate from HAC deserve it?  Absolutely not.  Does every individual who receives an Honorary Doctorate from Notre Dame deserve it?  Absolutely not.

 

[RAIDER]

I believe the problem is not with giving out Honorary Doctorates to those who "deserve" it.  The problem is when the Honorary Doctorate causes pride in the individual who receives it.

I had a pastor who supported a college on a mission field.  Our church was running 100 and was just a "normal" small IFB church.  When he visited the mission field he was given an Honorary Doctorate by the college.  When he came home he started printing literature with Dr. _____________ on it.  I started noticing pride in his ministry.  I am not blaming this on the doctorate, but within a few years the church closed its doors. 

 

[RAIDER]

Let's say you have an individual in the business world who spends years in college and earns a doctorate.  This fellow goes to work and ends up working a 40 hour job for average wage in an industry for which he did not study.

You have a second fellow who earns a four year degree.  He has no desire to attend grad school.  He starts a company that becomes one of the top companies in his industry.  His alma mater gives him an Honorary Doctorate.

Would we look at the first guy and say, "Wow!  He earned a doctorate.  He did the necessary studies and finished!!  This guy is great!"  Would we look at the second guy and say, "What a loser!  All he has is an Honorary Doctorate created to make him feel high and mighty.  He did nothing to earn that doctorate".

No!!!  We would do just the opposite.

 

[Norefund]

And yet, in this post, you refer to Jack Hyles as Dr. Hyles even though you know he did not earn a doctorate degree. The issue for me isn't if an honorary doctorate is or should be awarded. The issue is the practice of then promoting the usage of the Dr. title in front of the name of the honoree by the person or those referring to the person.

Examples: Dr. Lapina, Dr. Auclair, Dr, Schaap etc. It is used to make the individual appear to be more learned and to lend more credence. It is, as far as I known, only used in this manner in the IFB world. It is a ridiculous practice and only furthers the impression of academic weakness combined with pompous self-promotion rampant in the IFB world.

A person, preacher or pastor's reputation, standing, impression, worth, etc. should not be dependent upon or exaggerated by the usage of an artificial title.

I know that some considered it a weakness of Dr. Hyles, but I think we would all have to agree that he tried to lift up preachers in the eyes of those with whom he came in contact.  As he traveled around the nation he met up with preachers that were serving the Lord.  Many of these preachers were not well known.  Dr. Hyles brought them to HAC or Pastor's School and let them preach.

Some of these preachers had ministries that stood out.  Their churches were seeing many people saved and baptized and the church was growing.  I believe Dr. Hyles chose those who received an Honorary Doctorate from this group.

HAC is an IFB school for training IFB preachers.  Would it not make sense that they would give an Honorary Doctorate to an IFB preacher?  Now, does every preacher who received an Honorary Doctorate from HAC deserve it?  Absolutely not.  Does every individual who receives an Honorary Doctorate from Notre Dame deserve it?  Absolutely not.

 

[Norefund]

More than likely, we would do neither. The accomplishments of either example would speak for themselves without the usage of any honorary or earned title. What would be the point?

Let's say you have an individual in the business world who spends years in college and earns a doctorate.  This fellow goes to work and ends up working a 40 hour job for average wage in an industry for which he did not study.

You have a second fellow who earns a four year degree.  He has no desire to attend grad school.  He starts a company that becomes one of the top companies in his industry.  His alma mater gives him an Honorary Doctorate.

Would we look at the first guy and say, "Wow!  He earned a doctorate.  He did the necessary studies and finished!!  This guy is great!"  Would we look at the second guy and say, "What a loser!  All he has is an Honorary Doctorate created to make him feel high and mighty.  He did nothing to earn that doctorate".

No!!!  We would do just the opposite.

 

[RAIDER]

More than likely, we would do neither. The accomplishments of either example would speak for themselves without the usage of any honorary or earned title. What would be the point?

Let's say you have an individual in the business world who spends years in college and earns a doctorate.  This fellow goes to work and ends up working a 40 hour job for average wage in an industry for which he did not study.

You have a second fellow who earns a four year degree.  He has no desire to attend grad school.  He starts a company that becomes one of the top companies in his industry.  His alma mater gives him an Honorary Doctorate.

Would we look at the first guy and say, "Wow!  He earned a doctorate.  He did the necessary studies and finished!!  This guy is great!"  Would we look at the second guy and say, "What a loser!  All he has is an Honorary Doctorate created to make him feel high and mighty.  He did nothing to earn that doctorate".

No!!!  We would do just the opposite.

Are you against Honorary Doctorates at public universities?

 

[Norefund]

Not at all. I am also not against the bestowing of an honorary degree from an IFB institution. I am against the individual honored to insist or be referred to from that point on by whatever HONORARY title is bestowed. The individual should feel honored or appreciated but not entitled. The usage of the title afterward is my issue.

More than likely, we would do neither. The accomplishments of either example would speak for themselves without the usage of any honorary or earned title. What would be the point?

Let's say you have an individual in the business world who spends years in college and earns a doctorate.  This fellow goes to work and ends up working a 40 hour job for average wage in an industry for which he did not study.

You have a second fellow who earns a four year degree.  He has no desire to attend grad school.  He starts a company that becomes one of the top companies in his industry.  His alma mater gives him an Honorary Doctorate.

Would we look at the first guy and say, "Wow!  He earned a doctorate.  He did the necessary studies and finished!!  This guy is great!"  Would we look at the second guy and say, "What a loser!  All he has is an Honorary Doctorate created to make him feel high and mighty.  He did nothing to earn that doctorate".

No!!!  We would do just the opposite.

Are you against Honorary Doctorates at public universities?

 

[rsc2a]

You've heard people talk about Dr Ben Affleck?

 

[brainisengaged]

In my field, the people I know to have earned PhD's do not go around assuming the title of Dr. ________
And those are earned degrees.

In the medical field, it is of course common to refer to your Doctor as Dr. _________.  However, I recently had a doctor send me an email, something to do with an inquiry he had for me. He introduced himself in the email like this: "Hello, my name is Dr. Smith and I am writing to inquire of....."

I had to laugh to myself. Sir, your first name is NOT Dr., I'll wager. Get over yourself! If you wanted me to know you are a doctor, I would have noticed it in the superscription underneath your signature.

When honorary doctorates are conferred in most of the rest of the world, that person does not promptly adopt the title. It's a nice honor, it's a recognition of a body of work. It's a "you're one of us now" type fraternity. But it is just silly, small, and a little insulting for that person to commence referring to himself as Dr. So-and-So.

Now if others insist on addressing the person that way, there is not a lot the good doctor can do.

 

[Bruh]

I know that some considered it a weakness of Dr. Hyles, but I think we would all have to agree that he tried to lift up preachers in the eyes of those with whom he came in contact.  As he traveled around the nation he met up with preachers that were serving the Lord.  Many of these preachers were not well known.  Dr. Hyles brought them to HAC or Pastor's School and let them preach.

Some of these preachers had ministries that stood out.  Their churches were seeing many people saved and baptized and the church was growing.  I believe Dr. Hyles chose those who received an Honorary Doctorate from this group.

HAC is an IFB school for training IFB preachers.  Would it not make sense that they would give an Honorary Doctorate to an IFB preacher?  Now, does every preacher who received an Honorary Doctorate from HAC deserve it?  Absolutely not.  Does every individual who receives an Honorary Doctorate from Notre Dame deserve it?  Absolutely not.

Two things:

#1. Why not give a honorary doctorate to a Sunday School teacher who is a father of 2 or 3 kids that has to go to work everyday, rubs elbows with wicked men everyday then spend time with the family, study and then go to church to teach a 6th grade Sunday School class.  What is the difference between the preacher who gets paid to do this and the man who volunteers his time.  Wouldn't you say both labor in the word?

#2. Didn't HAC give a doctorate to a horse? If so what kind of honor is a person getting when they receive one from a place that give one to a horse?  Honest question.       

 

[cast.sheep]

I know that some considered it a weakness of Dr. Hyles, but I think we would all have to agree that he tried to lift up preachers in the eyes of those with whom he came in contact.  As he traveled around the nation he met up with preachers that were serving the Lord.  Many of these preachers were not well known.  Dr. Hyles brought them to HAC or Pastor's School and let them preach.

Some of these preachers had ministries that stood out.  Their churches were seeing many people saved and baptized and the church was growing.  I believe Dr. Hyles chose those who received an Honorary Doctorate from this group.

HAC is an IFB school for training IFB preachers.  Would it not make sense that they would give an Honorary Doctorate to an IFB preacher?  Now, does every preacher who received an Honorary Doctorate from HAC deserve it?  Absolutely not.  Does every individual who receives an Honorary Doctorate from Notre Dame deserve it?  Absolutely not.

Two things:

#1. Why not give a honorary doctorate to a Sunday School teacher who is a father of 2 or 3 kids that has to go to work everyday, rubs elbows with wicked men everyday then spend time with the family, study and then go to church to teach a 6th grade Sunday School class.  What is the difference between the preacher who gets paid to do this and the man who volunteers his time.  Wouldn't you say both labor in the word?

#2. Didn't HAC give a doctorate to a horse? If so what kind of honor is a person getting when they receive one from a place that give one to a horse?  Honest question.     

Did NOT know that....(giggle)

 

[RAIDER]

Two things:

#1. Why not give a honorary doctorate to a Sunday School teacher who is a father of 2 or 3 kids that has to go to work everyday, rubs elbows with wicked men everyday then spend time with the family, study and then go to church to teach a 6th grade Sunday School class.  What is the difference between the preacher who gets paid to do this and the man who volunteers his time.  Wouldn't you say both labor in the word?

#2. Didn't HAC give a doctorate to a horse? If so what kind of honor is a person getting when they receive one from a place that give one to a horse?  Honest question.     

#1  I think that is a great suggestion.  Bring up the idea to your pastor.

#2  Yes, they did.  It was done as a joke.  I believe it was Bill Rice's horse.

 

[Smellin Coffee]

Did NOT know that....(giggle)

I was there. It was John R. Rice's horse, MacArthur. See today's edition of The HACker Gazette!

 

[Bruh]

I know that some considered it a weakness of Dr. Hyles, but I think we would all have to agree that he tried to lift up preachers in the eyes of those with whom he came in contact.  As he traveled around the nation he met up with preachers that were serving the Lord.  Many of these preachers were not well known.  Dr. Hyles brought them to HAC or Pastor's School and let them preach.

Some of these preachers had ministries that stood out.  Their churches were seeing many people saved and baptized and the church was growing.  I believe Dr. Hyles chose those who received an Honorary Doctorate from this group.

HAC is an IFB school for training IFB preachers.  Would it not make sense that they would give an Honorary Doctorate to an IFB preacher?  Now, does every preacher who received an Honorary Doctorate from HAC deserve it?  Absolutely not.  Does every individual who receives an Honorary Doctorate from Notre Dame deserve it?  Absolutely not.

Two things:

#1. Why not give a honorary doctorate to a Sunday School teacher who is a father of 2 or 3 kids that has to go to work everyday, rubs elbows with wicked men everyday then spend time with the family, study and then go to church to teach a 6th grade Sunday School class.  What is the difference between the preacher who gets paid to do this and the man who volunteers his time.  Wouldn't you say both labor in the word?

#2. Didn't HAC give a doctorate to a horse? If so what kind of honor is a person getting when they receive one from a place that give one to a horse?  Honest question.     

Raider,this is why I said what I said for my #1. Because, of what you said...

 

[RAIDER]

I know that some considered it a weakness of Dr. Hyles, but I think we would all have to agree that he tried to lift up preachers in the eyes of those with whom he came in contact.  As he traveled around the nation he met up with preachers that were serving the Lord.  Many of these preachers were not well known.  Dr. Hyles brought them to HAC or Pastor's School and let them preach.

Some of these preachers had ministries that stood out.  Their churches were seeing many people saved and baptized and the church was growing.  I believe Dr. Hyles chose those who received an Honorary Doctorate from this group.

HAC is an IFB school for training IFB preachers.  Would it not make sense that they would give an Honorary Doctorate to an IFB preacher?  Now, does every preacher who received an Honorary Doctorate from HAC deserve it?  Absolutely not.  Does every individual who receives an Honorary Doctorate from Notre Dame deserve it?  Absolutely not.

Two things:

#1. Why not give a honorary doctorate to a Sunday School teacher who is a father of 2 or 3 kids that has to go to work everyday, rubs elbows with wicked men everyday then spend time with the family, study and then go to church to teach a 6th grade Sunday School class.  What is the difference between the preacher who gets paid to do this and the man who volunteers his time.  Wouldn't you say both labor in the word?

#2. Didn't HAC give a doctorate to a horse? If so what kind of honor is a person getting when they receive one from a place that give one to a horse?  Honest question.     

Raider,this is why I said what I said for my #1. Because, of what you said...

I agree it is a great idea.  Because of the information needed it would have to be done on a local church level.  Throw the idea out to your preacher.

 

[Bruh]

I know that some considered it a weakness of Dr. Hyles, but I think we would all have to agree that he tried to lift up preachers in the eyes of those with whom he came in contact.  As he traveled around the nation he met up with preachers that were serving the Lord.  Many of these preachers were not well known.  Dr. Hyles brought them to HAC or Pastor's School and let them preach.

Some of these preachers had ministries that stood out.  Their churches were seeing many people saved and baptized and the church was growing.  I believe Dr. Hyles chose those who received an Honorary Doctorate from this group.

HAC is an IFB school for training IFB preachers.  Would it not make sense that they would give an Honorary Doctorate to an IFB preacher?  Now, does every preacher who received an Honorary Doctorate from HAC deserve it?  Absolutely not.  Does every individual who receives an Honorary Doctorate from Notre Dame deserve it?  Absolutely not.

Two things:

#1. Why not give a honorary doctorate to a Sunday School teacher who is a father of 2 or 3 kids that has to go to work everyday, rubs elbows with wicked men everyday then spend time with the family, study and then go to church to teach a 6th grade Sunday School class.  What is the difference between the preacher who gets paid to do this and the man who volunteers his time.  Wouldn't you say both labor in the word?

#2. Didn't HAC give a doctorate to a horse? If so what kind of honor is a person getting when they receive one from a place that give one to a horse?  Honest question.     

Raider,this is why I said what I said for my #1. Because, of what you said...

I agree it is a great idea.  Because of the information needed it would have to be done on a local church level.  Throw the idea out to your preacher.

Ima call him right now!

 

[rsc2a]

Give an honorary doctorate to a horse as a joke and wonder why people say the whole process is a joke?

 

[cast.sheep]

Two things:

#1. Why not give a honorary doctorate to a Sunday School teacher who is a father of 2 or 3 kids that has to go to work everyday, rubs elbows with wicked men everyday then spend time with the family, study and then go to church to teach a 6th grade Sunday School class.  What is the difference between the preacher who gets paid to do this and the man who volunteers his time.  Wouldn't you say both labor in the word?

#2. Didn't HAC give a doctorate to a horse? If so what kind of honor is a person getting when they receive one from a place that give one to a horse?  Honest question.     

#1  I think that is a great suggestion.  Bring up the idea to your pastor.

#2  Yes, they did.  It was done as a joke.  I believe it was Bill Rice's horse.

Well, in all honesty, that explains a lot.  I mean, at the college they give/gave them to employees to justify their promotion to administrator/president for no other reason than they were friends with the pastor.  After all, how can a person be the President of a college without some kind of achievement? The Honorary isn't actually an "achievement", but it LOOKS like it is.  And, remember, it's all about how things look, not how they really are.  I'm just sayin'......