Discerning the Modern Bibles As Declining From His Testimonies

[prophet]

[quote author=prophet]What if someone mentioned that the nutcase castrated himself?  Did any 'kjvo' go THAT far?

If your hand causes you to sin and what-not...


[/quote]Sometimes it's good to see metaphors as metaphors. 

Anishinabe

 

[rsc2a]

[quote author=prophet]What if someone mentioned that the nutcase castrated himself?  Did any 'kjvo' go THAT far?

If your hand causes you to sin and what-not...

Sometimes it's good to see metaphors as metaphors. 

Anishinabe[/quote]

Hyperbole, but I get your point.

That's why I don't force "literal" views on other questionable passages.

 

[Enow]

Seriously, do you need to go so far as to insult those who are not KJVonly? When you say "those that love Him will be led by Him to see the KJV as one to rely on" you imply that the ones using a NIV or a ESV do not love God, or His Son.

That's in regards to reading after the fact:  not beforehand.  I had used the NIV and the NASB before the Lord had shown me why and how the KJV was keeping the message of His words and how those small changes in modern Bibles were supporting false teachings and apostasies today.

By this logic, we should throw out the KJV because of the folks who use its differences from the other translations to support false teachings and apostasies...

Name one false teaching supported by the KJV that is reproved by modern Bibles.

I already showed you Romans 8:26-27 but you seem to favour the issue of being an antiKJV onlyer than showing any concern about this expose, but then again, it is up to the Lord to show that to you.

Firstly, I'm not anti-KJV, nor are the overwhelming majority here. It's actually my wife's preferred translation. It's the "O" in "KJVO" that is the issue.

Secondly, I'm not talking about some wacky KJVO conspiracy theory about the proper understanding of the word "groan" and how it proves the KJV. (Funnily, this is the exact same nuttiness that leads Ruckman to heresy with his explanation of ghost/spirit and how it "proves" the KJV.) I'm talking about a legitimate doctrine that the Church widely holds.

I was hoping to deter the usual antiKJVonlyer rhetorics to stick to the issue.

I had failed to keep the matter to the scripture regarding about the way how one can use scripture to discern why the lost books are not in the Bible and thus in the same way, use the scripture in that modern Bible to see if they are keeping it in line with the rest of scripture which they did not do by way of Romans 8:26-27 but the KJV did by testifying that the Holy Spirit is not making these intercessions directly Himself because the Son of God knows the mind of the Spirit while searching our hearts and thus fulfilling His role as the only Mediator between God and man, because God the Father is glorified in the Son for making these intercessions between us and God the Father for which the Son is answering these prayers by.  John 14:6,13-14

But it seems to be too late now since the spirit of the thread is nothing short but anti-kjvonlyer and not the issue at hand on how one can see that modern Bibles are not keeping Romans 8:26-27 with the rest of the scripture in whatever modern Bible they are using.

The reference to KJV was to see how it wasn't because most modern Bible readers just gloss over the rest of scripture in that modern Bible as if they do not reprove Romans 8:26-27 as a false testimony and thus declining from the testimonies of the Son in being the only Advocate between us and the Father.

 

[Enow]

Psalm 119:157 Many are my persecutors and mine enemies; yet do I not decline from thy testimonies. 158 I beheld the transgressors, and was grieved; because they kept not thy word.

Well, aren't we off to a rocking start? Only one paragraph in, and you've already interpreted Psalm 119 illegitimately.

Sarcasm ill becomes you, brother.

For those that love the Lord that want to keep His words to continue in His words to be His disciple:  you are going to have to trust the Lord Jesus Christ as your Good Shepherd to help you to discern the modern Bibles as declining from His testimonies, and are supporting false teachings as well as apostasies.

The Lord Jesus Christ will never "help" me discern something that is not true. Otherwise, he rather than Satan is truly the father of lies.

James 1:5 If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, that giveth to all men liberally, and upbraideth not; and it shall be given him.

Hebrews 4:12 For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart. 13 Neither is there any creature that is not manifest in his sight: but all things are naked and opened unto the eyes of him with whom we have to do. 14 Seeing then that we have a great high priest, that is passed into the heavens, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold fast our profession. 15 For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin. 16 Let us therefore come boldly unto the throne of grace, that we may obtain mercy, and find grace to help in time of need.

Bear in mind why the lost books were not accepted in the Bible that we have today.  It is because the lost books go against the accepted scripture as no lie can be of the truth.

The NIV, NASB, and NKJV, to name three, have never had any books in them that were not part of the 66-book canon.  I assume by "lost books" you mean the Apocrypha, which, ironically, the KJV was published with from the beginning.

It was inserted inbetween the OT & the NT as a historical reference as the translators never considered them as actual scripture.

Now when discerning modern Bibles, and most believers will agree that they do not all say the same thing, we should use that same format by discerning any changed testimonies regarding the Son when it goes against other references in that modern Bible.

We may agree that they employ different wording. That much is self-evident, otherwise they would not be different translations.

Now, if you mean that modern Bibles contain a different message, well, then the onus is upon you to exegete a KJV and (say) and NIV and show us where the theology differs. You will fail. That is a foregone conclusion.

The only thing I can fail at is keeping this discussion to using whatever  modern Bible that believers are using to see how and why Romans 8:26-27 is not lining up with the truths in the rest of the scripture.

If the Holy Spirit will not speak of Himself ( John 16:13) and neither should we ( John 5:31) then the role of the Holy Spirit is to testify of the Son ( John 15:26 ) in seeking the glory of the Son, ( John 16:14 ) as those led by the Spirit will be doing the same thing ( John 15:27 ) in having that shared combined testimony for it to be true ( John 8:17) because God as God is glorified in the Son ( John 13:31-32 ) and the only way to honour God the Father is by honouring the Son as that judgment is hanging over every believer's head ( John 5:22-23 ).  That is what it means to be His disciple in serving the Lord Jesus Christ in seeking His glory and by Him, the glory of God the Father as that is the mind of Christ we are to have in worship ( Philippians 2:5-11 ) and in fellowship ( 1 Corinthians 1:9 & 1 Corinthians 2:2) and in prayer ( 1 Timothy 2:5 & John 14:6-7 ) because there is no other way to approach God the Father in anything except through the Son.

Holy crap. Would you like croutons with your word salad?

That was the reproofs by the scripture in how whatever modern Bible you are using, that Romans 8:26-27 cannot have the Holy Spirit make any intercessions directly Himself.  That was the whole point of that "word salad" to see how Romans 8:26-27 was not lining up with the rest of scripture in that modern Bible.

The whole point of Him being the only Mediator between God and man is to be at that throne of grace to be our Advocate and interceding for us on our behalf to God the Father as it is by the Son of God that prayers are answered which is why and how the Father is glorified in the Son.  John 14:13-14

Commas. Look into them.

[irrelevant pedantry about the Holy Spirit's intercession deleted for brevity]

Christ's love.  Where is it, brother?

Can people find the gospel message in all of the Bibles? Sure.  But that is not what this is about.  It is about having the meat of His words to discern good and evil in order for believers to continue therein to be His disciples. . . .

This is the line of discernment regarding modern Bibles because the small changes within that decline from the testimonies of the Son being the only Mediator between God and man has caused many believers to gloss over the rest of scripture in that modern Bible as if they do not apply or that it did not really meant what it had said, thus allowing false teachings to be supported and apostasy remains undiscerned and thus unreproved.

Talk about reductionism! You'd think from your rhetoric that the typical NIV reader derives all this theology exclusively from the English wording of the NIV, instead of the sum total of traditions, preaching, and theology as exegeted from the Scriptures throughout the Christian era.

The Holy Spirit cannot make any direct intercessions Himself.

John 16:13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.

That is why the Son is knowing the mind of the Spirit as He does in searching our hearts.

Was it a publishers' misprint that never got corrected?  I do not know, but the Lord has revealed that the modern Bibles have declined from the testimonies of the Son and are indeed responsible for this prophesy coming to pass again.

Since I believe in sola Scriptura, I do not believe that the Lord has "revealed" any such thing.  It is not to be found in the pages of the Bible, and I am not bound to accept whatever mystical opinions you believe have come to you from God. Therefore, I claim this "revelation" to be falsehood and foolishness.

Nothing mystical about it.  Jesus said that His disciples will be pruned so that they may bear more fruit and continue in His words as His disciples.  That is how we grow in the knowleldge of Him so that our love may abound more and more.

John 15:1I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman. 2 Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit. ....6 If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned. 7 If ye abide in me, and my words abide in you, ye shall ask what ye will, and it shall be done unto you. 8 Herein is my Father glorified, that ye bear much fruit; so shall ye be my disciples. 9 As the Father hath loved me, so have I loved you: continue ye in my love. 10 If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love. 11 These things have I spoken unto you, that my joy might remain in you, and that your joy might be full.

Philippians 1:6 Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ:....9 And this I pray, that your love may abound yet more and more in knowledge and in all judgment; 10 That ye may approve things that are excellent; that ye may be sincere and without offence till the day of Christ. 11 Being filled with the fruits of righteousness, which are by Jesus Christ, unto the glory and praise of God.

[remaining pedantry snipped]

I have always considered the point of making a snipping known to be insulting and provocative.  Is that how we are to edify one another in Christ's love?  No.

Ephesians 4:29 Let no corrupt communication proceed out of your mouth, but that which is good to the use of edifying, that it may minister grace unto the hearers. 30 And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption. 31 Let all bitterness, and wrath, and anger, and clamour, and evil speaking, be put away from you, with all malice: 32 And be ye kind one to another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God for Christ's sake hath forgiven you.

2 Timothy 2:24 And the servant of the Lord must not strive; but be gentle unto all men, apt to teach, patient, 25 In meekness instructing those that oppose themselves; if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth; 26 And that they may recover themselves out of the snare of the devil, who are taken captive by him at his will.

I do forgive you, brother, but I do wonder if I should continue here at all.

Galatians 5:14 For all the law is fulfilled in one word, even in this; Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. 15 But if ye bite and devour one another, take heed that ye be not consumed one of another. 16 This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh.

 

[Ransom]

prophet asked:

What if someone mentioned that the nutcase castrated himself?  Did any 'kjvo' go THAT far?

You've all castrated your brains, from what I can tell.  It's stopped you from reproducing new arguments that haven't already been discredited and laughed at for 20 years.

 

[Ransom]

Me:

Well, aren't we off to a rocking start? Only one paragraph in, and you've already interpreted Psalm 119 illegitimately.

Enow:

Sarcasm ill becomes you, brother.

You missed the point.

You illegitimately misappropriated Psalm 119.  FSSL demonstrated that conclusively.

The Lord Jesus Christ will never "help" me discern something that is not true. Otherwise, he rather than Satan is truly the father of lies.

The Lord Jesus Christ will never "help" me discern something that is not true. Otherwise, he rather than Satan is truly the father of lies.

James 1:5 If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, that giveth to all men liberally, and upbraideth not; and it shall be given him.

You missed the point.

KJV-onlyism is not true, therefore God, Christ, the Holy Spirit, or whatever other title of deity you wish to claim will not reveal it to me.  God does not reveal damnable lies as the truth.

Quoting all the Bible spoof-texts you wish won't change the lie of KJV-onlyism into the truth.

The NIV, NASB, and NKJV, to name three, have never had any books in them that were not part of the 66-book canon.  I assume by "lost books" you mean the Apocrypha, which, ironically, the KJV was published with from the beginning.

It was inserted inbetween the OT & the NT as a historical reference as the translators never considered them as actual scripture.

You missed the point.

In fact, you moved the goalposts. You said originally that "the lost books were not accepted in the Bible."

The truth is that the Apocrypha were accepted in the Bible, and published with the canonical books in the KJV for decades. The 1611 Authorized Version's front matter included a lectionary that scheduled daily Scripture readings for use in church services, including passages from the Apocrypha.  The Anglican church used those books, and regarded them as theologically significant.

Neither the NIV, NASB, nor NKJV has ever included the Apocrypha.

The only thing I can fail at is keeping this discussion to using whatever  modern Bible that believers are using to see how and why Romans 8:26-27 is not lining up with the truths in the rest of the scripture.

You also fail at writing coherent sentences.

Christ's love.  Where is it, brother?

I do love to see KJV-onlyists strongly insinuate that anyone who disagrees with their teachings are outside of the faith, and then in their next breath, appeal to our supposed shared Christian brotherhood by way of correction.

Consistency is not their greatest strength.

The Holy Spirit cannot make any direct intercessions Himself.

Does your pony do any other tricks?

Nothing mystical about it.

Subjective, Self-experienced, self-justifying "revelations' of the kind you have claimed are nothing but mysticism. No matter how many irrelevant Bible passages you spew afterwards. As FSSL mentioned above, since you mangled Psalm 119, why should we accept your misuse of any other Scriptures before you have accepted correction for your first misuse?

[remaining pedantry snipped]

I have always considered the point of making a snipping known to be insulting and provocative.

Thank you for expressing your opinion in this matter (Prov. 26:4).

[remainder of schoolmarmish scolding snipped]

 

[Enow]

Anybody else care to address or ignore the point about how the Holy Spirit cannot make these intercessions Himself in Romans 8:26-27 and thus why believers today should rely on the King James Bible for the meat of His words?

 

[Ransom]

Enow said:

Anybody else care to address or ignore the point about how the Holy Spirit cannot make these intercessions Himself in Romans 8:26-27 and thus why believers today should rely on the King James Bible for the meat of His words?

This isn't the "wacky theology about the Holy Spirit" forum. Perhaps we're just trying to stay on-topic, and leave the constant misdirections to the KJV-onlyists. It's one of the few things they do well.

 

[bgwilkinson]

I'm very sorry. I could not follow the posters logic. It just did not make any logical sense.
As for me I'll just stick with the Greek and all translations will be weighed against it.
Even Erasmus 1516 as poorly done as it was is better than a translation.