Compass College and Seminary

Mr. Ekklesian,

I have sat back and watched your interaction and now I will respond to you.

First of all, your "matter of fact statements" are borderline to calling another person a liar. (me)

Yes, we started the school to help people desiring to serve God. Who are you to challenge that when you don't know me or anyone on staff? Who are you to proclaim, "I don't believe this". Your comments are not an opinion but more so, an accusation that I am lying. Do you know what the Scriptures say about false witness? Watch the video, and at the 4:25 mark to 4:50 mark, the president talks about other schools. By stating your "impression", you sir are calling us liars. I won't stand for it. (https://compasscollegeandseminary.com/founder-president/)

I mentioned I Corinthians 13:7, but you choose not to believe all things, and suggested that I am asking you to be foolhardy, by taking me at my word. That is tantamount to calling me a liar. Do you get that? Rush Limbaugh was known for saying "Words mean things". When you chose to give your impression, it was tantamount to telling everyone you thought I was lying.

Second, we are NOT KJVO, and I won't sit here idly by and allow you to accuse us of that. There are many people who believe that the TR is preserved, and that the KJV which uses the TR, is the best translation of the Scriptures. Another comment of accusation and false witness. I will assume you are studied in the history of the Bible, but perhaps you should research and understand that this is NOT THE KJVO position. Our position is not the KJVO position. To suggest otherwise, even "matter-of-fact" is calling us again liars. (see link to understand the difference: https://carm.org/king-james-onlyism/what-is-king-james-onlyism/)

Third, regarding the association with other people. I wrote this and had a small typo, and @abcaines knows I clarified myself to him privately, which you could have easily have asked as well, and I truly apologize for the confusion. "I do believe we can work with people in certain areas, apart from church sanctioned events, for things in our community like standing against drag queen shows, abortion, etc. However, I believe that we have a responsibility to maintain purity within our local churches, and the ministries supported by those churches." Every church believes they should maintain a purity within their church. We are all different as churches for the sheer reason that each church does uphold different beliefs. Sir, I do apologize for the typo. But, if you are so upset that I accidently wrote "without", did you miss the first part of the sentence that said "we can work with other people...?" I am human just like you and apologize if that set you off.

Finally, I have been nothing but polite to you, and I do feel like you attacked me from the moment I have arrived. What kind of Christian demonstration of love is that? You sit back behind your keyboard and write such inflammatory accusations without any proof and when corrected, you simply huff and puff harder, as though that justifies your wrong behavior or validates your opinion. ("as is my right here") Does love of the brethren only extend to those you agree with? That's sad but funny, it's the very thing you accuse IFB people of. You have acted just like some of the IFB's of the past, and some of the present, that I also abhor.

In closing, I only visited your forum, because I was researching our search engine optimization efforts, and saw a mention of the college and seminary on your forum. I am not someone who writes on forums much any longer, as I don't have the time to participate. I pray that God will richly bless those who call upon the name of Christ as the Lord and Savior. Take care.

Ken
 
kmlengel said:
Mr. Ekklesian,

I have sat back and watched your interaction and now I will respond to you.

First of all, your "matter of fact statements" are borderline to calling another person a liar. (me)

Yes, we started the school to help people desiring to serve God. Who are you to challenge that when you don't know me or anyone on staff? Who are you to proclaim, "I don't believe this". Your comments are not an opinion but more so, an accusation that I am lying. Do you know what the Scriptures say about false witness? Watch the video, and at the 4:25 mark to 4:50 mark, the president talks about other schools. By stating your "impression", you sir are calling us liars. I won't stand for it. (https://compasscollegeandseminary.com/founder-president/)

I mentioned I Corinthians 13:7, but you choose not to believe all things, and suggested that I am asking you to be foolhardy, by taking me at my word. That is tantamount to calling me a liar. Do you get that? Rush Limbaugh was known for saying "Words mean things". When you chose to give your impression, it was tantamount to telling everyone you thought I was lying.

Second, we are NOT KJVO, and I won't sit here idly by and allow you to accuse us of that. There are many people who believe that the TR is preserved, and that the KJV which uses the TR, is the best translation of the Scriptures. Another comment of accusation and false witness. I will assume you are studied in the history of the Bible, but perhaps you should research and understand that this is NOT THE KJVO position. Our position is not the KJVO position. To suggest otherwise, even "matter-of-fact" is calling us again liars. (see link to understand the difference: https://carm.org/king-james-onlyism/what-is-king-james-onlyism/)

Third, regarding the association with other people. I wrote this and had a small typo, and @abcaines knows I clarified myself to him privately, which you could have easily have asked as well, and I truly apologize for the confusion. "I do believe we can work with people in certain areas, apart from church sanctioned events, for things in our community like standing against drag queen shows, abortion, etc. However, I believe that we have a responsibility to maintain purity within our local churches, and the ministries supported by those churches." Every church believes they should maintain a purity within their church. We are all different as churches for the sheer reason that each church does uphold different beliefs. Sir, I do apologize for the typo. But, if you are so upset that I accidently wrote "without", did you miss the first part of the sentence that said "we can work with other people...?" I am human just like you and apologize if that set you off.

Finally, I have been nothing but polite to you, and I do feel like you attacked me from the moment I have arrived. What kind of Christian demonstration of love is that? You sit back behind your keyboard and write such inflammatory accusations without any proof and when corrected, you simply huff and puff harder, as though that justifies your wrong behavior or validates your opinion. ("as is my right here") Does love of the brethren only extend to those you agree with? That's sad but funny, it's the very thing you accuse IFB people of. You have acted just like some of the IFB's of the past, and some of the present, that I also abhor.

In closing, I only visited your forum, because I was researching our search engine optimization efforts, and saw a mention of the college and seminary on your forum. I am not someone who writes on forums much any longer, as I don't have the time to participate. I pray that God will richly bless those who call upon the name of Christ as the Lord and Savior. Take care.

Ken
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I believe that it is very possible that I resemble the make up of your belief structure closer than anybody else on this forum. I understand if you don’t have a lot of time to interact due to all of your other competing responsibilities, but I do hope that you reconsider and stick around for a while, interacting whenever you get the chance.
 
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@Ekklesian,

On a more relaxed note. I understand why you think people start schools because they are at odds with another school. I want to share with you a few thoughts. I actually talked with my mentor ar MBU before we launched and shared our desire to help train students for ministry. In addition, our president is on the board at Ambassador and spoke with Dr. Comfort and Dr. Beal before we announced as well, along with Dr. Sexton at Crown. They all encouraged us and have offered advice, assistance, and their prayers.

As for why, it is because the labourers are few. It is my opinion that we all focused so much on regional turfs in the past, rather than the better way to build a school, through one's church and pastor's sphere of influence. Do some in the same region, and even same beliefs overlap a bit sometimes? Most definitely! However, after 40 years in IFB circles, it amazes me that the overlap is smaller than we think, hence why we don't reach more who would desire to learn and serve God.

I respect and cherish my professors and friends from MBU. And I know our president Tim Cruse feels the same of ABU and Crown, as do I.

As we said on our website and videos, we want to do our part with all God has given us to raise up the next generation as the Lord tarries.

I hope we can move past these posts Ekklesian. I hope you know my heart a little better now.
 
Mr. Ken - I concur with the sentiments of Alayman. With the exception of an occasional bad apple that drops in for nefarious purposes, everyone who is active on the forum (and there aren’t many) is a pretty decent man or woman. We occasionally have our disagreements, and sometimes we like to stir the pot a little (my hand is raised), but I think every active user is a good and decent person. I hope you stick around. I’ve already learned some as a result of your posts (what TR refers to).
 
Stick around, Ken. I own the forum. We lightly moderate the discussions.
 
abcaines said:
I had a private discussion with him about this very subject. I came clean with him about who I am and where I stand. We have mutual respect for one another.

I'll admit I thought the position as stated on the website was extreme but an investigation of the truth of the matter is a little more balanced. I still think it's not smart trying to come off that extreme but then again, I'm not the one he answers to.

You all will be relieved to hear that he doesn't intend to hang around here thanks in large part to the reception he has received.

You know I find it ironic that your attitude toward the position stated on the website to be a perfect mirror of that very position: one of maintaining a separation from those who differ.

Another bridge burned. Well done thou good and faithful servant.
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I hope he sticks around. I miss guys on here like Tom Brennan and other IFB types of whom I would often disagree but they certainly would keep me honest!

I am seeing the very same attitude from Ekk that I have seen from certain IFBx types who were overly critical of anything and everything outside of their particular "camp!" I do not mean to be excessively harsh here towards Ekk, I just hope he takes a moment to look in the mirror and "Check Himself" to make sure he does not become that which he himself condemns!

And as I am typing this response, I feel like I am chastising a version of myself from about 20 years or so who was ready to blow anything out of the water that even smelled like it was a part of "that crowd!"

I would also take exception to the blanket statement that KJVO is a cult. There are most certainly some that are cultic but not all. I would avoid Ruckmanites and HACkers like the plague but I have no problem with Paul Chappell's flavor of KJVO where they use the KJV exclusively in their services and in the Bible College but are not piling up modern "perversions" and lighting bonfires with them! After all these years, I am still pretty much "KJV Preferred" although I have no problem citing my ESV if it brings clarity to a passage but I digress...
 
Baptist Renegade said:
I hope he sticks around. I miss guys on here like Tom Brennan and other IFB types of whom I would often disagree but they certainly would keep me honest!

I am seeing the very same attitude from Ekk that I have seen from certain IFBx types who were overly critical of anything and everything outside of their particular "camp!" I do not mean to be excessively harsh here towards Ekk, I just hope he takes a moment to look in the mirror and "Check Himself" to make sure he does not become that which he himself condemns!

And as I am typing this response, I feel like I am chastising a version of myself from about 20 years or so who was ready to blow anything out of the water that even smelled like it was a part of "that crowd!"

I would also take exception to the blanket statement that KJVO is a cult. There are most certainly some that are cultic but not all. I would avoid Ruckmanites and HACkers like the plague but I have no problem with Paul Chappell's flavor of KJVO where they use the KJV exclusively in their services and in the Bible College but are not piling up modern "perversions" and lighting bonfires with them! After all these years, I am still pretty much "KJV Preferred" although I have no problem citing my ESV if it brings clarity to a passage but I digress...
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Right and I was responding to the quote from their website that I thought was over the top but I wanted to hear from a representative of the school. Again, not what I would post on a website but a little talking with someone reveals the truth about the statement to fall far short of my perception. Actually, some recent dialogue with @ALAYMAN and Mr. Ken has taught me not to immediately get defensive if someone's apparent position seems odious to me.

Again, I have very deep feelings for the IFB crowd even though I don't hold to some of their standards. IFBdom is where I received the main body of the discipleship that made me what I am today and that is solid in my faith and not ashamed of standing on the Word. For that, I'll forever be grateful.

In fact, this is why I am so looking forward to our trip to Florida this coming summer. It will be like visiting my hometown. The part that really excites me is taking my precious bride to these places and reliving memories with her by my side. While we are in Pensacola, I want to fellowship with the PCC crowd for a Wednesday service plus I have been in contact with folks from the Pensacola CMA chapter... hopefully, a ride happens while we're there. It's kinda an old meets new... All with Christ at the center.
 
kmlengel said:
Second, we are NOT KJVO, and I won't sit here idly by and allow you to accuse us of that. There are many people who believe that the TR is preserved, and that the KJV which uses the TR, is the best translation of the Scriptures. Another comment of accusation and false witness. I will assume you are studied in the history of the Bible, but perhaps you should research and understand that this is NOT THE KJVO position. Our position is not the KJVO position. To suggest otherwise, even "matter-of-fact" is calling us again liars. (see link to understand the difference: https://carm.org/king-james-onlyism/what-is-king-james-onlyism/)
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I'm probably not too far removed from where you are on this issue. I was hard-core KJVO and a "Ruckmanite" and it took me a good while to get over such nonsense. I often like telling the story that I did not abandon the KJVO position because I was persuaded by anti-KJVO types like James White or whoever, I abandoned KJVO because it was the only way I could distance myself from all of the nutjobs and actually find a good Church for myself and my family!

As far as the details go, I plead ignorance but favor the Syriac-Byzantine line because they are in the overwhelming majority of textforms and I believe this ought to have some significance. I try to understand those who come from the "Older and Better" mindset and they are my fellow brothers and fellow servants in Christ.
kmlengel said:
Third, regarding the association with other people. I wrote this and had a small typo, and @abcaines knows I clarified myself to him privately, which you could have easily have asked as well, and I truly apologize for the confusion. "I do believe we can work with people in certain areas, apart from church sanctioned events, for things in our community like standing against drag queen shows, abortion, etc. However, I believe that we have a responsibility to maintain purity within our local churches, and the ministries supported by those churches." Every church believes they should maintain a purity within their church. We are all different as churches for the sheer reason that each church does uphold different beliefs. Sir, I do apologize for the typo. But, if you are so upset that I accidently wrote "without", did you miss the first part of the sentence that said "we can work with other people...?" I am human just like you and apologize if that set you off.
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I think we all practice "Ecclesiastical Separation" to one extent or another. For example, I strongly believe in keeping Hillsong United, Bethel, and Elevation out of our Church and I believe we need to be careful regarding what we are using for Sunday School curriculum. As an SBC Church (a conservative one just so you know), we do not support missionaries from other denominations but we do participate in ministries such as "Joni and Friends" and "Samaritan's Purse" among others. IFBs may be a little tighter in their affiliations and that is fine. Where they decide to draw the line of separation is their business, not mine.

All in all, I hope you stick around and feel welcome here! We may not always agree and that is fine but I believe your perspective would be of benefit here.

And if you have some really good arguments against Calvinism, I would love to hear them! Some folks on here try to convince me that my Calvinistic views are wrong but they really, really suck at it! :ROFLMAO: Perhaps you could help them out?:cool: Then again, if you actually favor the doctrines of grace, I believe we can both be gracious towards the "weaker brethren" here!:ROFLMAO:
 
kmlengel said:
I hope you know my heart a little better now.
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As I said, you have been cordial and I think you are acting in good faith. I just made a couple of matter of fact statements about my impressions and got piled on by the 'Christian love' here. I just had to remind them that it's they who gather the tar and feathers for the fundamentalist thought outlined in the school's statement of faith, though I wouldn't stand in their way. Might even unlock my shed for them, but that has nothing to do with you.

I didn't call you a liar, or even hinted so. We'll just have to agree to disagree on that. I think you believe what you said. I just think you're a bit presumptuous.

That thought is formed in no small part by the description in the OP--a description left unanswered if it's inaccurate:

Compass appears to seek to carve out a new constituency among fundamental Baptists rather than "feasting upon the corpse" of dead or dying institutions.​

Reading that my thought was, here we go again.

Happy Thanksgiving.
 
Ekklesian said:
As I said, you have been cordial and I think you are acting in good faith. I just made a couple of matter of fact statements about my impressions and got piled on by the 'Christian love' here. I just had to remind them that it's they who gather the tar and feathers for the fundamentalist thought outlined in the school's statement of faith, though I wouldn't stand in their way. Might even unlock my shed for them, but that has nothing to do with you.

I didn't call you a liar, or even hinted so. We'll just have to agree to disagree on that. I think you believe what you said. I just think you're a bit presumptuous.

That thought is formed in no small part by the description in the OP--a description left unanswered if it's inaccurate:

Compass appears to seek to carve out a new constituency among fundamental Baptists rather than "feasting upon the corpse" of dead or dying institutions.​

Reading that my thought was, here we go again.

Happy Thanksgiving.
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Ekklesian,

Your responses are no longer worth my time. If you do not understand what you did is calling me a liar, then there is no reason continuing this discussion. ("I think you believe what you said")

To the rest of you on the board, may God bless you in your service to Him.

Ken
 
abcaines said:
You know I find it ironic that your attitude toward the position stated on the website to be a perfect mirror of that very position: one of maintaining a separation from those who differ.
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Not sure what you mean here. No one's trying to run anyone off. But, as you know, my parents are Pentecostal, and one of my best friends is Catholic. We have great conversations about Mary and Jesus and the Bible. Some of them over a wee dram of some prime hooch.

We don't attend church together, but we have great fellowship.
 
As far as the kjvo-ism is concerned--The superstition that the TR was specially preserved is its root. If a translation from that family of manuscripts suggests a different reading in one part than found in the KJV, which one do you think would be considered God's preferred reading?

And I'll just leave it at that.
 
Ekklesian said:
As far as the kjvo-ism is concerned--The superstition that the TR was specially preserved is its root. If a translation from that family of manuscripts suggests a different reading in one part than found in the KJV, which one do you think would be considered God's preferred reading?

And I'll just leave it at that.
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Do you believe in Biblical preservation of any kind and if so what’s your theory on how it works?
 
ALAYMAN said:
Do you believe in Biblical preservation of any kind and if so what’s your theory on how it works?
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Fair question! I don't think TR guys believe that the "Majority Text" is inspired and the "Critical Text" is not. They simply believe that the Majority Text is superior to the Critical Text and the "Alexandrian" types believe otherwise. It is simply a matter of good men agreeing to disagree.
 
Baptist Renegade said:
Fair question! I don't think TR guys believe that the "Majority Text" is inspired and the "Critical Text" is not. They simply believe that the Majority Text is superior to the Critical Text and the "Alexandrian" types believe otherwise. It is simply a matter of good men agreeing to disagree.
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I got into these Majority vs Alexandrian arguments and quickly found myself in over my head.

I believe God has the ability to preserve His Word just as He wants it. He's not constrained to one body of text or one language. For the believer who is serious about the Word, I believe the Holy Spirit will be the primary agent of truth when considering various texts. Because I am not a linguist, I have to trust those who are. I have been around long enough and I know enough basics that I have a good idea who is trustworthy. Again, the Holy Spirit guides. I've heard some teaching where the Spirit didn't affirm what I was hearing. Only to discover later that indeed the individual was off base.
 
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