A personal relationship with a mega church pastor

[RAIDER]

During the past several years there have been several posts concerning a lack of personal contact with Dr. Hyles while he pastored.  I have to admit that I attended HAC for 4 years and never once had a conversation with him.  I actually spoke to him a couple of times after I graduated.  I will say that I did not feel distant from him and I did feel loved by him. 

Here are the topic questions - How could Dr. Hyles have had more personal contact with each of us that attended HAC and/or FBCH?  How did you feel your relationship with was with Dr. Hyles?   

 

[Binaca Chugger]

My situation was very different, because I grew up there.  Bro. Hyles was a friend to me.  He and I were actually close. 

One of his uncanny abilities was to make everyone who met him feel like they were close to him and knew him.  I think this was partially because they wanted to feel close to him, and partially because of his many personal stories that he shared.  After reading a good biography, you might feel like you really know the person because you have been "Let In" to their personal life.  Bro. Hyles accomplished this same thing through his story telling and illustrations.  Of course, we learned later that there was much that was never revealed in public.

Personally, I feel that if the church is too big for the pastor to have a cup of coffee with any member who needs some time - it is too big.

 

[RAIDER]

One of his uncanny abilities was to make everyone who met him feel like they were close to him and knew him.  I think this was partially because they wanted to feel close to him, and partially because of his many personal stories that he shared.  After reading a good biography, you might feel like you really know the person because you have been "Let In" to their personal life.  Bro. Hyles accomplished this same thing through his story telling and illustrations.  Of course, we learned later that there was much that was never revealed in public.

That is a great observation.  I believe I fell in the category you described.

 

[RAIDER]

My situation was very different, because I grew up there.  Bro. Hyles was a friend to me.  He and I were actually close. 

Just for interest sake, was this time period before or after HAC started?

 

[RAIDER]

Personally, I feel that if the church is too big for the pastor to have a cup of coffee with any member who needs some time - it is too big.

So what is the answer to this problem?  The majority of the people attended because of the preaching and teaching of Dr. Hyles.

 

[Binaca Chugger]

My situation was very different, because I grew up there.  Bro. Hyles was a friend to me.  He and I were actually close. 

Just for interest sake, was this time period before or after HAC started?

Much, much after.  I primarily knew him in his last decade.

 

[RAIDER]

My situation was very different, because I grew up there.  Bro. Hyles was a friend to me.  He and I were actually close. 

Just for interest sake, was this time period before or after HAC started?

Much, much after.  I primarily knew him in his last decade.

That is interesting.  Most members that were close to Dr. Hyles seemed to be during the pre-HAC years.  How did you manage to spend time with him? 

 

[kaba]

No relationship. Went to his office with a friend, because she wanted to get advice for something. Stood there very ackwardly in his office. He did not know me. Husband to be went to him to ask/tell that he wanted to marry me, and hyles said, "I know her". Guess I passed the test. Dont think he really knew me!!!

 

[Binaca Chugger]

My situation was very different, because I grew up there.  Bro. Hyles was a friend to me.  He and I were actually close. 

Just for interest sake, was this time period before or after HAC started?

Much, much after.  I primarily knew him in his last decade.

That is interesting.  Most members that were close to Dr. Hyles seemed to be during the pre-HAC years.  How did you manage to spend time with him?

The short answer:  He wanted to be my friend.  Later, I wanted to be his.  We didn't spend ALOT of time together, but I did see him more frequently than most students.  At times, I took his advice.  At times, he took mine (After a heated argument).  We were actually pretty close - more like family than anything else.  So, yes, it rocked my world to learn later the truth behind the man I knew.

I realize my situation was different.  Personally, I don't think any church should grow much over 300.  Such growth actually begins to consume so much of the pastor's efforts that he is no longer able to personally shepherd the flock and spiritual regression begins.

 

[Binaca Chugger]

No relationship. Went to his office with a friend, because she wanted to get advice for something. Stood there very ackwardly in his office. He did not know me. Husband to be went to him to ask/tell that he wanted to marry me, and hyles said, "I know her". Guess I passed the test. Dont think he really knew me!!!

Hysterical.

Honestly though, he knew more about the students than the students realized.  JH had an amazingly high IQ.  He had a natural ability to remember names.  In staff meetings they poured over student's records: who would get positions, who would be disciplined, who would be pardoned.  The "Administrative Committee" that met in the Fireplace Room was actually just an intimidation group who held very little power.  Any real decisions came from JH himself.  Hence, JH actually knew more about the students than the students might think he did.  If you went to see him, he probably remembered you and would consider you a "good girl" because you were willing to see him.

Hopefully, his prediction to your fiance' was correct. 

 

[RAIDER]

Personally, I don't think any church should grow much over 300.  Such growth actually begins to consume so much of the pastor's efforts that he is no longer able to personally shepherd the flock and spiritual regression begins.

I understand in theory, but here is the problem - Let's say that you have a group of people that love the Lord and are being fed by the teaching and preaching coming from the pulpit.  They are winning souls and inviting their friends and neighbors.  Over a certain period of time the church grows to 300 or 400.  What do you do?

 

[RAIDER]

Hopefully, his prediction to your fiance' was correct. 

It was her fiance' that was the problem. 

 

[tobytyler]

He was my pastor for 25 years.  He baptized me in '72, married me in '89---I was in his office once to set a wedding date, and that's the extent of my personal connection to him as my pastor.  He knew me but there never was a personal bond.

When I was in high school, he went to Great America, twice I think, with the teenagers, but only a few were able to get any one-on-one time with him.  This, too, was him in a large group setting. 

During my time there, he didn't make hospital calls, he wouldn't go to funeral homes to officiate a funeral, if he officiated a funeral in the auditorium then Bro Colsten would handle all of the cemetery services.  He wasn't too hands on....although I've heard that he started visiting in the hospitals in his later years.

 

[SwampHag]

I was there for 4 years and never had a conversation with him.
However, when I moved away, I attended one of his out of town meetings shortly afterwards.
He was preaching when he noticed hubby and I sitting in the audience.  He said, "Hey, I know you, you're *my* people.  Piano side, second section".  <exactly where we sat every service>
Yeah, he noticed everyone.

 

[RAIDER]

He was preaching when he noticed hubby and I sitting in the audience.  He said, "Hey, I know you, you're *my* people.  Piano side, second section".  <exactly where we sat every service>
Yeah, he noticed everyone.

That is amazing.

 

[Binaca Chugger]

Personally, I don't think any church should grow much over 300.  Such growth actually begins to consume so much of the pastor's efforts that he is no longer able to personally shepherd the flock and spiritual regression begins.

I understand in theory, but here is the problem - Let's say that you have a group of people that love the Lord and are being fed by the teaching and preaching coming from the pulpit.  They are winning souls and inviting their friends and neighbors.  Over a certain period of time the church grows to 300 or 400.  What do you do?

Split the church.  Let the assistant pastor who has been trained in the local church be ordained by the local church.  Have a group of families who respect him and are able to disciple others fo with him to a part of the city where many of your families commute and start a new church.  This is the pattern of the church before the need to get out egos stroked by sending the most teens to our alma mater.

 

[RAIDER]

Split the church.  Let the assistant pastor who has been trained in the local church be ordained by the local church.  Have a group of families who respect him and are able to disciple others fo with him to a part of the city where many of your families commute and start a new church.  This is the pattern of the church before the need to get out egos stroked by sending the most teens to our alma mater.

Two thoughts:

1)  I understand your thinking in a FBCH situation.  People come from all directions.  When you are in a town of 25,000 I'm not sure this is the way to go.

2)  Like it or not, certain preachers are able to get God's Word to the hearts of certain people.  These folks may be growing under the preaching and teaching on this pastor.

 

[kaba]

Hopefully, his prediction to your fiance' was correct. 

It was her fiance' that was the problem. 

I keep trying to give him back to his parents, but they wont take him....nobody will!!!

I go to a large church (I think), I guess it runs over 500. My children and I sit in the same spot every Sunday morning (very back row on left side of the Pastor!) I dont get to the "other side" very often. Asst Pastors wife saw me the other day in the parking lot and said, boy, didnt know if you still attending here!! She sits on the other side. So does SherryH and her husband.  I am often afraid to ask someone if they are visiting because they might be new or old members!! But I like the size of my church. Pastor isnt too busy to text or answer his cell or the church phone. I happen to work for a deacon, so I actually talk to Pastor often! He has a close relationship with my children.

 

[Binaca Chugger]

Split the church.  Let the assistant pastor who has been trained in the local church be ordained by the local church.  Have a group of families who respect him and are able to disciple others fo with him to a part of the city where many of your families commute and start a new church.  This is the pattern of the church before the need to get out egos stroked by sending the most teens to our alma mater.

Two thoughts:

1)  I understand your thinking in a FBCH situation.  People come from all directions.  When you are in a town of 25,000 I'm not sure this is the way to go.

2)  Like it or not, certain preachers are able to get God's Word to the hearts of certain people.  These folks may be growing under the preaching and teaching on this pastor.

I've seen it happen in cities is smaller than yours. This does require that the pastor properly trained for disciple someone to be able to pastor, which is not normal today. It also requires the pastor to believe the truth is bigger than himself. Most pastor today, especially in the ifb, believe that the people cannot understand the bible with out himself teaching.

 

[Holy Mole]

I wasn't at HAC too long. I did stand in line on a few or occasions for the timed 2 minutes or whatever it was. He did have an amazing ability to give you all his attention in that short span and make you feel that he cared. I felt that I could even joke with him some and he even roasted me publicly (in a jestful way). He knew me as the guy from (where I'm from) but I doubt he knew my name.  On two occasions I waited the couple months for the 15 minute appointment. The first time he flew through my questions, smiled and thanked me for saving him 8 minutes then practically pushed me out of his office. On the second he needed to check with his staff about something and get back with me and never did.

I meet him once or twice more since graduation. He was friendly, almost playful but very short. He was a busy guy and valued his time above all else...can't blame him.