Depression?

[ALAYMAN]

Are there any varieties of depression that are not organic, but spiritual/sin related?

In talking to a coworker, a person says that they've suffered in periodic lifelong cycles from chronic depression, and that their symptoms were helped by pharmaceuticals, but the "zombie" side-effects were more undesirable than the removal of the depressive thoughts/feelings, what advice would you give?

 

[T-Bone]

This is a tough one....so many varibles to consider.  I believe there certainly are spiritual and emotional causes for depression as well as biological.  I think in most cases we want a quick answer for a problem that will not be solved that way.  Patience and love, understanding and being willing to walk with the person are needed in dealing with the chronically depressed.  I think we have to be careful to just throw the prayer thing or "have faith" thing at people.

 

[Bob]

Are there any varieties of depression that are not organic, but spiritual/sin related?

In talking to a coworker, a person says that they've suffered in periodic lifelong cycles from chronic depression, and that their symptoms were helped by pharmaceuticals, but the "zombie" side-effects were more undesirable than the removal of the depressive thoughts/feelings, what advice would you give?

Varieties of Depression?  As in "Different varieties are caused by different things?"  I have many years of experience, both personally and with a couple family members. Serious, clinical depression.  It is so complicated that you cannot classify different "varieties" as you say and localize them to certain causes.  The inter-relation ship between the spiritual and physical is so intertwined that it is almost impossible to separate them.

 

[FSSL]

Are there any varieties of depression that are not organic, but spiritual/sin related?

In talking to a coworker, a person says that they've suffered in periodic lifelong cycles from chronic depression, and that their symptoms were helped by pharmaceuticals, but the "zombie" side-effects were more undesirable than the removal of the depressive thoughts/feelings, what advice would you give?

There are times where medicines help a person focus. Coupled with biblical counseling, the root issues may be found. If, like David, the symptoms are sin-related, a biblical counselor can help him/her work through it.

Definitely get a doctor involved.

 

[rsc2a]

[quote author=FSSL]

There are times where medicines help a person focus. Coupled with biblical counseling, the root issues may be found. If, like David, the symptoms are sin-related, a biblical counselor can help him/her work through it.

Definitely get a doctor involved.
[/quote]

I recommend this one...

...he makes me days better.

 

[Bob]

Are there any varieties of depression that are not organic, but spiritual/sin related?

In talking to a coworker, a person says that they've suffered in periodic lifelong cycles from chronic depression, and that their symptoms were helped by pharmaceuticals, but the "zombie" side-effects were more undesirable than the removal of the depressive thoughts/feelings, what advice would you give?

There are times where medicines help a person focus. Coupled with biblical counseling, the root issues may be found. If, like David, the symptoms are sin-related, a biblical counselor can help him/her work through it.

Definitely get a doctor involved.

I agree.  Some of the Biblical Counseling models out there say that Doctors and medicine have no place and that all psychological problems can be traced to spiritual causes and only biblical counseling can solve them. It was Jay Adams that started that.  It is just not true.

 

[FSSL]

Right... nouthetic counseling has progressed in many quarters.

 

[FSSL]

[quote author=FSSL]

There are times where medicines help a person focus. Coupled with biblical counseling, the root issues may be found. If, like David, the symptoms are sin-related, a biblical counselor can help him/her work through it.

Definitely get a doctor involved.

I recommend this one...

...he makes me days better.
[/quote]

Lol. You just sent Alayman into depression!

 

[Bob]

[quote author=FSSL]

There are times where medicines help a person focus. Coupled with biblical counseling, the root issues may be found. If, like David, the symptoms are sin-related, a biblical counselor can help him/her work through it.

Definitely get a doctor involved.

I recommend this one...

...he makes me days better.

Lol. You just sent Alayman into depression!
[/quote]

I think I will look for this one at the store tonight.

 

[rsc2a]

[quote author=Bob]I think I will look for this one at the store tonight.[/quote]

It's actually a micro-brewery's version of Dr Pepper so no alcohol. They are a PITA to find but IMHO taste a lot better. If you've heard of Virgil's Root Beer or Reed's Ginger Ale, it's the same guys.

 

[FSSL]

We went to the Dr Pepper museum in Waco, TX. It tastes even better there.

 

[T-Bone]

[quote author=Bob]I think I will look for this one at the store tonight.

It's actually a micro-brewery's version of Dr Pepper so no alcohol. They are a PITA to find but IMHO taste a lot better. If you've heard of Virgil's Root Beer or Reed's Ginger Ale, it's the same guys.
[/quote]

Watch out Frag will be here soon to condemn the packaging as giving the "appearance of evil"  er I mean "beer"...oh same difference! 8)

 

[ALAYMAN]

[quote author=Bob]

Varieties of Depression?  As in "Different varieties are caused by different things?"  I have many years of experience, both personally and with a couple family members. Serious, clinical depression.  It is so complicated that you cannot classify different "varieties" as you say and localize them to certain causes.  The inter-relation ship between the spiritual and physical is so intertwined that it is almost impossible to separate them.
[/quote]

Google "varieties of depression" and you'll see scholarly examples of manic, chronic, seasonal, etc, definitions/descriptions of depression.

I'm particularly interested in an answer to the latter part of my OP.  If one particular pharmacological med is causing zombie-like symptoms, so much so that the patient would rather face the effects of the depression, what would you suggest?

 

[ALAYMAN]

[quote author=Bob]I think I will look for this one at the store tonight.

It's actually a micro-brewery's version of Dr Pepper so no alcohol. They are a PITA to find but IMHO taste a lot better. If you've heard of Virgil's Root Beer or Reed's Ginger Ale, it's the same guys.
[/quote]

What does your acronym that appears just before "IMHO" stand for?

 

[Bob]

[quote author=Bob]I think I will look for this one at the store tonight.

It's actually a micro-brewery's version of Dr Pepper so no alcohol. They are a PITA to find but IMHO taste a lot better. If you've heard of Virgil's Root Beer or Reed's Ginger Ale, it's the same guys.

What does your acronym that appears just before "IMHO" stand for?
[/quote]

Pain in the A _ _

 

[Bob]

Are there any varieties of depression that are not organic, but spiritual/sin related?

In talking to a coworker, a person says that they've suffered in periodic lifelong cycles from chronic depression, and that their symptoms were helped by pharmaceuticals, but the "zombie" side-effects were more undesirable than the removal of the depressive thoughts/feelings, what advice would you give?

I would not give anyone who is currently on drugs any advice. I would refer them to their Dr to get advice.

 

[HeDied4U]

Are there any varieties of depression that are not organic, but spiritual/sin related?


In talking to a coworker, a person says that they've suffered in periodic lifelong cycles from chronic depression, and that their symptoms were helped by pharmaceuticals, but the "zombie" side-effects were more undesirable than the removal of the depressive thoughts/feelings, what advice would you give?

Varieties that are spiritual/sin related? I would answer yes, but would be hard pressed to put a name to them. All I can go on is my personal experience.

I suffer from depression. Under normal circumstances, medicine helps keep it under control and I can lead a normal life. Sometimes however, even with medicine, I can have what I call dark days. My thoughts are all in a jumble and sometimes I feel as if the only way "out" is to hurt myself in some way (cutting, for example). There is really no rhyme or reason to these "attacks," but I have noticed that when there is unrepentant sin in my life, those episodes can (sometimes) be even worse. I had one such episode a couple of weeks ago where I was very afraid I would do something really stupid, but after putting out a request for prayer, I was in a better frame of mind the next morning. After taking care of some underlying spiritual issues, I was back to what I consider normal by mid-day that day.

As for the zombie-like side effects, I can't really speak to that since I have never really experienced them, but perhaps trying a different medication may help the individual. When I was first diagnosed, the medication I was taking made me feel like every nerve in my body was tingling. Not a very good feeling. Worked with my doctor and we eventually found one that helped me to function normally.

 

[Gina B]

Are there any varieties of depression that are not organic, but spiritual/sin related?

In talking to a coworker, a person says that they've suffered in periodic lifelong cycles from chronic depression, and that their symptoms were helped by pharmaceuticals, but the "zombie" side-effects were more undesirable than the removal of the depressive thoughts/feelings, what advice would you give?

Always, always start off any advice to someone like that with letting them know you can't answer it and they need to talk to their doctor about it. A combination of therapy/medical doctor is what is needed.

But...I'd probably ask myself and that person a few questions.

I'd ask the person their type of depression. I'd ask myself if I trusted the person to tell the truth. I'd ask the person how those who lived with him/her felt about their depression and how they act on medication vs how they act when off. There are some people who can be very violent or get very manic when off meds, but everyone wants to feel in control, so when the meds do work, they get to thinking they can handle things without them and before you know it, they're out of control.

In the end, my main advice would be to talk to their doctor about trying a lower dose or being brought off the one in order to try another. Even if they  quit, they'd have to do it under the advice and care of a physician. You can't just stop taking certain psych meds cold turkey. People try that and go suicidal or violent or have heart attacks, you name it. My neurologist put me on Depakote for migraines some years ago. (the reason I bring it up is that it can also be used for bipolar, so it can also be considered a psych med) I had no clue how much it was affecting me mentally, btw, but that's not the point. Point is that I developed an allergy to it, even though it worked beautiful and stopped the migraines. I had an intense central tremor, my blood pressure shot up, but it worked and I begged to stay on it, but the doctor said "nope, you're allergic now and it will only get worse and it will end up killing you."  Despite that, he didn't stop me cold turkey. The dosage was lowered while another medication was given to help with the side effects. I'd never, ever aid someone in making the decision to stop a medication without the help of their doctor. The person making the decision also needs to talk to their immediate family and possibly to friends and workers they trust, because those are the people who can give honest opinions about the person's personality and behavior prior to medication and because THAT is who the behaviors also impact. It's really not fair to not take the considerations of those around you into account when making a decision like that. Of course they need to take the person and their health and wants into account too when they give their input, and that's where getting the opinions of more than just one person really is a good tool.
Then when the person DOES go to the doctor, the spouse or person closest to them should accompany them in order to help give a complete perspective on the patient.

 

[ALAYMAN]

I appreciate the first-hand knowledge and experiences.  They helped affirm what I already suspected was the best path to take for counsel, and that being to advise the person to consult with their physician to see about a dosage adjustment, or alternate pharmaceutical that might not have the same effect.

As Gina pointed out, many times folk elect to stop taking their meds, without their doctor's consent/advice, and when they get back to their funk/depression they want relief from it but don't want to go back to the meds because they don't want the <zombie, lethargic, numb, etc> effects brought on by the drugs.  In such cases they may ask for advice from non-medical professionals in the spiritual realm, hoping for a quick-fix or a miraculous relief from God.  I've never been there, thanks be to God, but I do have personal family knowledge of someone with a debilitating physical malady which requires heavy-duty narcotics for pain management.  In that case, the dilemma they have told me about regarding dealing with pain management by taking the drug is made difficult when they consider the mind-numbing effects the drug brings.  There's not an easy choice in that matter, even under consultation/care of a physician.  I imagine the dynamic of depression-treating psychotropics are similar.

 

[Holy Mole]

Man having a body, soul and spirit can have depression issues if any of the three are not cared for correctly. In my opinion it could be an issue with any or all of the above. It could range from an improper diet(yes, this is proven) to repressed memories(e.g. sexual abuse as a child), to simply not seeking and fulfilling God's purpose for their life. I think it should be dealt with on all levels.