Are they a dying breed?

[RAIDER]

For many years it was fairly easy to find an "in your face" IFB preacher or evangelist.  As the years pass I believe we are seeing less and less of this type.  I am talking about the Bob Gray Sr./Keith Gomez type.  Who else can you think of that still fits this type of mold?  Do you think "this type" is a dying breed?  If so, why?

 

[Bruh]

Dying? Possibly yes.

Why? I really believe its unbiblical.

 

[Sherryh]

Tony Hudson

 

[patriotic]

I remember hearing an older preacher once say something about when he was young his favorite sermons to develop and preach were those hard sermons against sin - the "in your face" type, I think what you described  As he got older, the love of God was much easier to preach about, though - as a pastor - he had to have balance. 

Perhaps these men you've mentioned,  and others who may have been like that have just aged......and matured some. 

I know - though I am a woman - I am older, but I would much rather hear a sermon on the love of God than the rip-roaring "in your face" sermons that seemed more enjoyable to hear when I was young.er. 

 

[Walt]

For many years it was fairly easy to find an "in your face" IFB preacher or evangelist.  As the years pass I believe we are seeing less and less of this type.  I am talking about the Bob Gray Sr./Keith Gomez type.  Who else can you think of that still fits this type of mold?  Do you think "this type" is a dying breed?  If so, why?

I certainly hope that they are.  I have heard evangelists and missionaries attempt to be like these two.

 

[Walt]

For many years it was fairly easy to find an "in your face" IFB preacher or evangelist.  As the years pass I believe we are seeing less and less of this type.  I am talking about the Bob Gray Sr./Keith Gomez type.  Who else can you think of that still fits this type of mold?  Do you think "this type" is a dying breed?  If so, why?

It would probably help to define terms... what do you mean by an "in your face" preacher?

I don't have any problem with a preacher preaching plainly against sin.

However, Mr Gomez comes across to me as a gangster: "...if you don't agree with me, I'll meet you in the parking lot and we'll straighten this out".  Bob Gray, Sr, has many times spoken of his joy and thrill at embarrassing and humiliating people, and I've personally seen him do this to both adults and teens.  He will take things told to him in confidence as a pastor and talk about them -- usually, naming no names, but sometimes it's just too obvious whom he was talking about.

It's this kind of pseudo-macho arrogant attitude that I consider "in your face".

 

[Walt]

I remember hearing an older preacher once say something about when he was young his favorite sermons to develop and preach were those hard sermons against sin - the "in your face" type, I think what you described  As he got older, the love of God was much easier to preach about, though - as a pastor - he had to have balance. 

Perhaps these men you've mentioned,  and others who may have been like that have just aged......and matured some. 

I know - though I am a woman - I am older, but I would much rather hear a sermon on the love of God than the rip-roaring "in your face" sermons that seemed more enjoyable to hear when I was young.er.

The real gospel messages in the Scriptures don't start with "How would you like to go to heaven when you die?" or "God has a great plan for your life!", but rather start with the utter holiness and righteousness of God, and the deep sinfulness of mankind.  This kind of message is very Scriptural.  It is after the sinfulness of man is made plain and the Holy Spirit convicts of sin that the way to be reconciled to God is given.  I'm less and less impressed with the "how to go to heaven" salesmanship that is going on these days.

 

[Fresh Air]

For many years it was fairly easy to find an "in your face" IFB preacher or evangelist.  As the years pass I believe we are seeing less and less of this type.  I am talking about the Bob Gray Sr./Keith Gomez type.  Who else can you think of that still fits this type of mold?  Do you think "this type" is a dying breed?  If so, why?

Do you think "this type" is a dying breed?
...yes

  If so, why?
...some answers might include

-they have killed themselves; their systems have withered
-the internet is now widely used, and it wreaks havoc on the tightly bound and controlling systems these guys try to replicate
-the JS implosion caused a lot of self-examination and a turn toward graciousness and humility
-the bigger, more influential IFB colleges (think Crown, West Coast, and even HAC now) lead and teach leadership with more care; back when HAC was huge and the staff were young and JH was proud it produced proud men; there are no more big IFB colleges with such blatant pride and immature harshness; even Fairhaven has mellowed a bit under its new pastor

I've never been more encouraged about our future. Some of that is b/c of the regular positive feedback I am getting from Schizophrenic so perhaps my view is skewed, but I really think the younger men and increasingly the leadership in the IFB movement is becoming more gracious and humble.

 

[sword]

For many years it was fairly easy to find an "in your face" IFB preacher or evangelist.  As the years pass I believe we are seeing less and less of this type.  I am talking about the Bob Gray Sr./Keith Gomez type.  Who else can you think of that still fits this type of mold?  Do you think "this type" is a dying breed?  If so, why?

Do you think "this type" is a dying breed?
...yes
  If so, why?
...some answers might include
-they have killed themselves; their systems have withered
-the internet is now widely used, and it wreaks havoc on the tightly bound and controlling systems these guys try to replicate
-the JS implosion caused a lot of self-examination and a turn toward graciousness and humility
-the bigger, more influential IFB colleges (think Crown, West Coast, and even HAC now) lead and teach leadership with more care; back when HAC was huge and the staff were young and JH was proud it produced proud men; there are no more big IFB colleges with such blatant pride and immature harshness; even Fairhaven has mellowed a bit under its new pastor
I've never been more encouraged about our future. Some of that is b/c of the regular positive feedback I am getting from Schizophrenic so perhaps my view is skewed, but I really think the younger men and increasingly the leadership in the IFB movement is becoming more gracious and humble.

For your own copy of  Schizophrenic , by Tom Brennen, just click the link at the top of this page.

 

[RAIDER]

I remember hearing an older preacher once say something about when he was young his favorite sermons to develop and preach were those hard sermons against sin - the "in your face" type, I think what you described  As he got older, the love of God was much easier to preach about, though - as a pastor - he had to have balance. 

Perhaps these men you've mentioned,  and others who may have been like that have just aged......and matured some. 

I know - though I am a woman - I am older, but I would much rather hear a sermon on the love of God than the rip-roaring "in your face" sermons that seemed more enjoyable to hear when I was young.er.

Well put.

 

[Baptist City Holdout]

Good conversation!

 

[Walt]

For many years it was fairly easy to find an "in your face" IFB preacher or evangelist.  As the years pass I believe we are seeing less and less of this type.  I am talking about the Bob Gray Sr./Keith Gomez type.  Who else can you think of that still fits this type of mold?  Do you think "this type" is a dying breed?  If so, why?

I've never been more encouraged about our future. Some of that is b/c of the regular positive feedback I am getting from Schizophrenic so perhaps my view is skewed, but I really think the younger men and increasingly the leadership in the IFB movement is becoming more gracious and humble.

If we don't kill ourselves with worldliness, compromise, and loss of separation.

 

[patriotic]

I remember hearing an older preacher once say something about when he was young his favorite sermons to develop and preach were those hard sermons against sin - the "in your face" type, I think what you described  As he got older, the love of God was much easier to preach about, though - as a pastor - he had to have balance. 

Perhaps these men you've mentioned,  and others who may have been like that have just aged......and matured some. 

I know - though I am a woman - I am older, but I would much rather hear a sermon on the love of God than the rip-roaring "in your face" sermons that seemed more enjoyable to hear when I was young.er.

The real gospel messages in the Scriptures don't start with "How would you like to go to heaven when you die?" or "God has a great plan for your life!", but rather start with the utter holiness and righteousness of God, and the deep sinfulness of mankind.  This kind of message is very Scriptural.  It is after the sinfulness of man is made plain and the Holy Spirit convicts of sin that the way to be reconciled to God is given.  I'm less and less impressed with the "how to go to heaven" salesmanship that is going on these days.

....and this has to do  with what I said above exactly how?       

 

[Fresh Air]

I remember hearing an older preacher once say something about when he was young his favorite sermons to develop and preach were those hard sermons against sin - the "in your face" type, I think what you described  As he got older, the love of God was much easier to preach about, though - as a pastor - he had to have balance. 

Perhaps these men you've mentioned,  and others who may have been like that have just aged......and matured some. 

I know - though I am a woman - I am older, but I would much rather hear a sermon on the love of God than the rip-roaring "in your face" sermons that seemed more enjoyable to hear when I was young.er.

I largely agree. I think some of that is the natural mellowing that comes with the wisdom of experience and age (and, no, I didn't say you were old.) But I think more of it comes from Christian maturity. When you are young and aggressive you love to hear preachers tell off the people that in your view are carnal, lazy, selfish, excuse ridden Christians. As you grow in grace your concept of preaching becomes more along the lines of "just tell me what God said."

 

[Walt]

I remember hearing an older preacher once say something about when he was young his favorite sermons to develop and preach were those hard sermons against sin - the "in your face" type, I think what you described  As he got older, the love of God was much easier to preach about, though - as a pastor - he had to have balance. 

Perhaps these men you've mentioned,  and others who may have been like that have just aged......and matured some. 

I know - though I am a woman - I am older, but I would much rather hear a sermon on the love of God than the rip-roaring "in your face" sermons that seemed more enjoyable to hear when I was young.er.

The real gospel messages in the Scriptures don't start with "How would you like to go to heaven when you die?" or "God has a great plan for your life!", but rather start with the utter holiness and righteousness of God, and the deep sinfulness of mankind.  This kind of message is very Scriptural.  It is after the sinfulness of man is made plain and the Holy Spirit convicts of sin that the way to be reconciled to God is given.  I'm less and less impressed with the "how to go to heaven" salesmanship that is going on these days.

....and this has to do  with what I said above exactly how?     

Well, I started out in one  direction and got rather carried away.

What I was thinking is that while I agreed that I like to hear messages on the love of God - it can lead people to repentance, the Bible tells us.

At the same time, if our constant diet of messages is the love of God, we are getting an unbalanced view of God.  Preachers are to preach the whole counsel of God, and that includes messages denouncing sin and/or focusing on the holiness of God and the penalty for sin.  I'm not sure that preaching the holiness of God is considered "in your face" kind of "preaching" - in my opinion, most of the preaching of Bob Gray, Sr isn't preaching, but just ranting about whatever is vexing him at the moment.  I haven't heard enough of Keith Gomez' messages to know, but I have heard enough to know that I didn't like his aggressive "I'm right and I'll prove it by beating you up" kind of tough-guy messages.

As I've gotten older, the love of God and the grace of God has become far more precious to me as I realize what I sinner I am before God.

 

[prophet]

I remember hearing an older preacher once say something about when he was young his favorite sermons to develop and preach were those hard sermons against sin - the "in your face" type, I think what you described  As he got older, the love of God was much easier to preach about, though - as a pastor - he had to have balance. 

Perhaps these men you've mentioned,  and others who may have been like that have just aged......and matured some. 

I know - though I am a woman - I am older, but I would much rather hear a sermon on the love of God than the rip-roaring "in your face" sermons that seemed more enjoyable to hear when I was young.er.

I largely agree. I think some of that is the natural mellowing that comes with the wisdom of experience and age (and, no, I didn't say you were old.) But I think more of it comes from Christian maturity. When you are young and aggressive you love to hear preachers tell off the people that in your view are carnal, lazy, selfish, excuse ridden Christians. As you grow in grace your concept of preaching becomes more along the lines of "just tell me what God said."

The last line. 

earnestly contend

 

[patriotic]

I remember hearing an older preacher once say something about when he was young his favorite sermons to develop and preach were those hard sermons against sin - the "in your face" type, I think what you described  As he got older, the love of God was much easier to preach about, though - as a pastor - he had to have balance. 

Perhaps these men you've mentioned,  and others who may have been like that have just aged......and matured some. 

I know - though I am a woman - I am older, but I would much rather hear a sermon on the love of God than the rip-roaring "in your face" sermons that seemed more enjoyable to hear when I was young.er.

I largely agree. I think some of that is the natural mellowing that comes with the wisdom of experience and age (and, no, I didn't say you were old.) But I think more of it comes from Christian maturity. When you are young and aggressive you love to hear preachers tell off the people that in your view are carnal, lazy, selfish, excuse ridden Christians. As you grow in grace your concept of preaching becomes more along the lines of "just tell me what God said."

I have absolutely no problem whatsoever in claiming every single one of my 29 years.